PDA

View Full Version : 80 Job Losses at Ilford


Mike O'Pray
6th May 2009, 04:48 PM
On the "other" site there was a reference last night to a very short announcement on the AP website that Ilford/Harman had announced 80 job losses. No press announcement there by Ilford nor anything in this week's AP but it probably would have gone to press too soon.

Anybody seen or heard any more on this? I was prompted to post this seeing the comments on another thread on 7dayshop prices and the Ilford price hike in the last 12 months.

Cue long playing record but it just seems to me that the price hike hitting the market when we have begun the deepest recession since the 1930's was bad consumer psychology and I have seen nothing from Ilford on the other site or anywhere else indicating empathy and maybe action as to how it would share the pain.

It kind of hints at a relationship in which the supplier believes the consumer needs it more than it needs the consumer. Well unfortunately in any recession, consumers have to vote with their feet due to personal finances and no company action can wholly stem this but it can influence how reluctantly or not consumers do so and crucially it needs to fight to maintain the previous healthy consumer relationship for the return of better times.


Mike

Richard Gould
6th May 2009, 05:01 PM
Mike, I agree with your comments, I was considering using more ilford paper in future, but their recent price hike has made me think, I can get foma papers, which I think are as good, or, in the case of fomatone,Better than the ilford warmtone, cheaper at some suppliers, so possibly second thoughts, and I bet I won't be the only one,Richard

Bob
6th May 2009, 05:22 PM
At the BJP: http://www.bjp-online.com/public/showPage.html?page=854941

Mike O'Pray
6th May 2009, 07:17 PM
Thanks Bob. A much better report than AP and it seems to indicate that it's part of a longer term restructuring plan that may not entirely be connected with the recession but it seems rather large,even at 50, for just new technology/efficiency savings.

Still better than 80 and if it's even partially down to restructuring then this isn't totally a crisis move.

All we now need is an announcement that Ilford will hold its prices for say 18 months. With zero inflation, this shouldn't be impossible and might even be necessary to maintain demand.

Mike

Trevor Crone
6th May 2009, 07:28 PM
Lets hope is 'size down' is from natural wastage (never did like that phrase), voluntary redundancy and retirements.

With regard to a price freez I suspect this largely depends where they have to source their materials from? The strength of the Euro and US$ is making things expensive outside the UK.

Dave miller
6th May 2009, 08:51 PM
Lets hope is 'size down' is from natural wastage (never did like that phrase), voluntary redundancy and retirements.

With regard to a price freez I suspect this largely depends where they have to source their materials from? The strength of the Euro and US$ is making things expensive outside the UK.

True, but the bottom dropped out of the silver market some months ago.

Trevor Crone
6th May 2009, 09:11 PM
True, but the bottom dropped out of the silver market some months ago.

I was thinking of more basic commodities then silver, i.e., paper types, film base, raw chemicals, etc.

Dave miller
7th May 2009, 06:54 AM
I was thinking of more basic commodities then silver, i.e., paper types, film base, raw chemicals, etc.

I would not give them the luxury of such an excuse. Their main income is not in sterling.

Tom Stanworth
11th May 2009, 06:57 AM
What is the value of the silver in, say, a roll of 35mm film? Is it really that significant? I confess to not having the foggiest idea.

This links in with recent comments by Salgado on the 'quality of modern films' in which he complains, while announcing that he gas gone d****l, that when comparing images shot some time ago with those more recently, the differences are immediately obvious. I find this hard to believe. After all, he used to shoot a lot of Tmax 3200 (and ocassionally Tmax100) in addition to loads of TriX. The Tmax films have always been thin emulsions with much lower silver content than film of olde. And then there is the issue of how silver content affects the final image. As far as I can tell, the loss of some of the best papers of yesteryear is the bigger factor, but from my recent experience with Ilford MG and WT, they seem better now than ever before. The WT seems exceptional compared to what I remember in 2004. The MG has more gloss, more depth etc. This shows that things can improve.

If silver content were a real factor in final image quality, one would expect the manufacturer to offer the consumer the option. Seeing as most users are now dedictated types, one would expect consumers to gladly pay more if the images were decidedly richer. I am not sure that this relationship exists however. I do not mean to crank up this old debate, but it does make me wonder when someone who produces such stunning fibre prints (OK, his printer is exceptional too) complains about modern films. I have always preferred traditional emulsions overall, but have no experience of anything before about 2001, so cannot say if even they have very different imaging qualities compared to before. I am far from convinced.

Trevor Crone
11th May 2009, 04:04 PM
Having used film since the mid 1970's to the present day, including such films as, Tri-x, TMX 100, Pan F, HP4&5, FP4, Delta 100/400, Acros 100, Neopan 400, Rollei Retro 100, APX 25/100. I must confess I can't see any appreciable difference in the old and new, other then grain structure.

Probably my favourite film was 4x5 APX 100. This had probably the edge on sharpness and wonderful long straight line section. Responded well to staining developers. But I'm more then happy with what is currently on the market; Delta 100/400 and FP4 and HP5. If Delta 400 was available in sheet film then this would be my film of choice, smoooooth as a babies bum:) But I'm talking about finesse not a quantum difference.

Mike O'Pray
12th May 2009, 06:35 PM
Just for interest or not as the case may be, this week's AP has a short article on it. Little new to say but it seems as if it's the "business sector" revenue that is suffering and has caused the redundancies.

It gives numbers and sticks with the 80 job losses, quoting if I recall 444 to 364.

I wonder if the amateur non business users like us are to some extent helping llford's viability by the price increases. I just don't know how much of Ilfordphoto's profitability and viability depends on what I'll term the amateur market.

Desperate times and desperate measures spring to mind. If we are in effect distress purchasers ( customers willing to pay over the odds) with great price inelasticity as economists would say,then it must be tempting to use the amateur market to boost revenue.

Maybe great will be our reward for services rendered when the good times return.

Mike