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Argentum
27th February 2009, 11:02 PM
Another of my I'm curious questions:

How many print developments do you do on average before arriving at your final print. Please include test strips. And if the urge takes you, please let us know here how long it takes to complete your avearage print?

Mike O'Pray
27th February 2009, 11:29 PM
Depends on the print and circumstances. If I am concentrating on printing the bulk of a 36 frame roll then once my analyser is calibrated for the highlights in what looks like a good representative neg, I'll do one print per neg and find that in most cases this suffices.

Recently however I was asked to print a neg of a print of a neighbour's great uncle and aunt taken during the First World War and which had been copied onto a 35mm neg by someone else. H ehad done a good job of the neg but had printed it too dark for my neighbour.

I made one test strip of about 5 exposures and calibrated the analyser probe on the best strip. I then tried several different grades but my eventual final print was only 1/2 grade more than what the analyser with its inbuilt formula said it should be.

If truth were told then I am still not sure my judgement beats the analyser. The half grade difference was mighty subtle and the next day I swung between the two prints like a pendulum. The neighbour wasn't sure either which he liked the best.

So maybe out of a whole roll taken on the same day or similar light conditions I'll do say a 5 test strip exposure on a Paterson test strip printer from a representative neg and
print one straight print per neg.

Maybe I am easily pleased but I'll only make an extra effort if the neg I really like gives me serious printing problems. A black dog and white dog in sunlit water springs to mind.

I have decided there's a "happy snaps" operative in me waiting to get out!

Mike

Dave miller
28th February 2009, 07:52 AM
An interesting question, to which I have no single definitive answer, hence the overuse of the word “usually”.
I usually make a whole frame test print on a sheet of 10x8 R/C paper which covers 12 quarter stop steps at the enlargers white light setting, that’s a little above grade 2. From this I can usually see which exposure I want to use, although I might add or subtract a fraction of a stop before making the next whole frame print on the same type of paper, I may also adjust contrast at this point too if using a VC paper. It is this second print that usually allows me to decide if I want to crop, or change the contrast further. I may make a third print on R/C if I’m still unsure. If I’m producing a finished print on paper that I’m familiar with I will then apply previously found exposure, and enlargement factors and make a final print(s) on whatever paper I’ve chosen.
Sometimes I strike lucky and find a negative that has dozens of crop, printing, and toning permutations in it, and happily consume boxes of paper on it as I get lost with it for weeks.

Trevor Crone
28th February 2009, 08:49 AM
I too have no real definitve answer. On average it is about 4 steps; 1) test strip, 2) straight print, 3) manipulated print then 4) final print attempt. This can then be followed with fine tuning and slight variations as to depth of printing, ie lighter/darker.

If the negative is from a sequence of images that I've already made prints from then quite often I do away with the test strip and go straight to the straight print.

Steven Taylor
28th February 2009, 09:54 AM
As with every other answer so far it depends, at the moment I am working on collections to sell so... on average, I make a contact sheet of the whole film. Then I select and make straight work prints on best guess exposure, I've got quite good at that. I will leave those prints laying around for a while and decide from those which I want to print. For the finished work, I will make at least two, maybe three or four test strips or complete test prints using the full range of my older style RH timer, so 10 1/4 stops. Then a straight print, with obvious burning, dodging. Then, hopefully a finished print that I am happy with but I might need to have several more goes at it. When I've got it I make 10 more prints of the same size (11x8 on 14x11). I am also making 10x8 and 20x16 editions.

So in answer to your question at least 18 could be 25 or 30. I am currently getting through 1 box of 14x11 MGFB a week.
Steven
Ps by the time I have finished washing, selenium toning, hypo clearing and washing again that's a full 8 hour day per image. And then they say "£150 for a photograph? I'd pay that for a painting that takes a lot of work...but you can get photographs from Asda for a few pence each."

Jack Lusted
28th February 2009, 12:30 PM
Well, if I'm doing a fairly straight forward print from a neg that is properly exposed and developed then it can be as low as three (test strip, work print, final print). On the other hand some negs are right pigs to print well and so it can be five or six. Any more than that and I give up!

jack

photomi7ch
28th February 2009, 12:47 PM
Depending on how good the neg 30 to 60 min's averaging out at about 30 min's start to finish for the neg I've chosen to print no other elements included contact sheet etc etc

Richard Gould
28th February 2009, 08:33 PM
I tend to use an R.H.Designs anylserpro and find that I tend to make 2 prints on average, the first directly from the anylser's settings then a further print with some adjustments to the settings to fine tune the finished print.Richard

Martin Aislabie
1st March 2009, 11:49 AM
I print in stages - the first round is nothing more than a look to see if the Neg has merrit

The second round is can the print be worked up to something decent.

The final round is fine tuning to get to a half decent print

In between rounds, I ignore them for a few days then go back to them fresh for another look.

Martin

David Lingham
1st March 2009, 03:54 PM
As many as it takes to get what I want. Sometimes on the 3rd print, others I'm never happy with.

Bob
2nd March 2009, 11:50 AM
Typically... two or three test strips (one with 10 x 0.5 stop steps to see what happens at the extremes) followed by a straight print covering the important areas of the image. Then dodging/burning/etc tests of specific areas using torn-off bits of paper to dial-in detail - or I will use another largish part-sheet as above - depends how big the area is. Then a final print with all the work included. Probably another one or two to see how slightly different manipulation looks if I am being pedantic.

So, quite a bit of trial and error. I'm not one who can look at the straight print and see in my head just how much manipulation a section needs - I have to try it out first and I'm rarely happy with the first "final" manipulated print.

Trevor Crone
2nd March 2009, 02:53 PM
Bob, you've raised an important issue when you mention, 'to see what happens at the extremes'. The American photographer Michael A. Smith has a term which he calls 'out flanking the print'. He makes a print that is too dark and works back from that.

Victor Krag
2nd March 2009, 07:03 PM
The final print is last one that I made only untill I set about printing another batch from that single neg. It's unlikely that any print of mine is exactly alike, most negs require some b&d to make a "Fine Print". What invariably makes the "best" print is decided after the toning process is complete. So, somewhere between 4 and 80.

Dave miller
2nd March 2009, 08:25 PM
It a good point others are making. What constitutes a final print? My forth print should be classed as my first final print since I generally then go on to reproduce it in a variety of sizes.

Trevor Crone
2nd March 2009, 09:29 PM
My final print is the one I'm happy with and is fit for purpose.

I was printing on Saturday and by the time I had produced the 3rd print (including test strip) I had arrived at what for me was the final print and one I was happy with. I went on to produce 2 more prints from this negative.

The second negative I printed from was exactly the same, the 3rd print was the final one and again I made two further prints from this negative.

I should point out that I had printed these negatives before but at a different size and on different paper.

Victor Krag
2nd March 2009, 11:12 PM
That very first 3 or 5 sec increment test strip at Grade 2, or whichever you use, can help to show an approximate exposure time that the sky area / highlights might require after the basic overall exposure is decided... unless you have the perfect neg that requires no D&B. I've sometimes regretted tossing test strips too soon.

Argentum
6th March 2009, 07:55 PM
A difficult question to answer because I doubt that any of us count how many test strips or reprints we do.
The more frequently I print or the bigger the batch of prints being done, then the quicker it seems to happen and one or two test strips may be saved when I'm in the swing as it were. But then you get that neg you really want to do some serious work on and it could 10 or 12 print devs. But then there may a roll of film with well exposed negs which are not being worked on and only 2 devs per print are required. I think if they were for exhibition I may spend a lot more time on them.