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alexmuir
20th August 2014, 02:28 PM
I have one of these, and I have noticed that the lens has a lot of dirt or other markings on it. I'm keen to have a go at cleaning it myself. It is the 105mm Ensar Anastigmat in an Epsilon shutter. It looks like removal of a retaining ring behind the lens should release the whole assembly from the camera. The ring has either two,or four indents on its outer edge. I presume these are for a turning tool? The retainer is quite close to, and partially covered by the bellows material. Is there a technique to avoid damage, or is it a case of taking extreme care? Once the lens is off the camera, I'm fairly sure I can at least improve its clarity. I wouldn't want to render the camera useless, however if attempting this is likely to lead to disaster! Any advice would be appreciated.
Alex

Xpres
20th August 2014, 06:11 PM
I usually loosen it with a lens spanner and then undo it a quarter turn at a time with the tip if a screwdriver. A long nose... so to speak... lens spanner would help as you'd be able to open the bellows some.

alexmuir
20th August 2014, 09:31 PM
Thanks. I have a device for removing the backs of watches which has adjustable pins. I will give it a try if I can get it to reach far enough into the bellows. It may be sufficient to loosen the ring until I can turn it with a screwdriver.
Alex

Steven
20th August 2014, 09:54 PM
Hi Alex,

I do a*lot* of optic cleaning in my day job.

My best advice is: Don't dismantle anything you don't really need to dismantle. Clean only that which really needs cleaning. Blow off any loose dust you can, first. Use a blower brush or can of air. Gently brush off anything else with a really soft brush. Then... Clean wet - I mean use cleaning fluid. Use either cotton wool or lens tisdue but gently, don't rub and don't reuse the tissue or cotton, wipe over once, discarde, get another one.

The reason for this is that most lenses are ruined by scratching. Lens cloths are the invention of the devil. Too expensive to throw away, they get reused, dry, and so any grit or dirt is constantly rubbed back into the delicate glass surface :mad: better to by a big bag of cotton wool from the chemist (very cheap) - use once and discard. It is important to blow and brush off any loose particles as these may be gritty. You don't want to make a grinding paste out of lens cleaner and grit!

It is difficult to get decent solvents these days due to health and safety laws and such.... Propriety lens cleaners these days are mostly a drop of detergent and water. They won't do any harm - but aren't great either. Ethanol or propanol is better if you can get it. Alcohol in the form of methylated spirits or surgical spirits (rubbing alcohol to the Americans) is ok... But the stuff they put in to stop folk drinking it can sometimes leave streaks or a deposit.
Never use acetone!!! This is a great glass cleaner... But is also a great solvent of paint, glue, the balsam that cements lenses together....

If you can remove elements from the camera - or even better from the lens barrel and you are struggling to get off grime - warm water and washing up liquid won't hurt the glass at all. (Your shutter wouldn't appreciate it so much ;-) )


As for removing the lens assembly... Should be easy to get at with the back open but the bellows closed. The "traditional" way is to cross over two screwdrivers or use long nose pliers. Part of the tradition is that you then slip and scrap the lens by scratching it. :mad: You can buy proper face spanners on eBay and amazon. Until you get one.... Don't do it!!!!
But is it necessary?
Are you sure you can't just unscrew the rear element and leave the barrel / shutter assembly behind? I have an embarrassingly large collection of folding 6 x 6 cameras and most of them you can unscrew the rear element this way. If it is tight then use a rubber bung or a champagne cork.

Just my two penneth. :)

alexmuir
20th August 2014, 11:40 PM
Hi Steven and thanks for the advice. I will try to remove the rear element without dismantling, although it doesn't appear to have anything to locate a tool. I can try a rubber bung on the rim. I don't need to have a perfect lens, but would prefer it to be cleaner than it is. Thanks for your glass cleaning tips which will undoubtedly help with this, and future projects.
Alex

richardw
21st August 2014, 09:37 AM
Eclipse drops on a PEC PAD is safe and very effective. Go gently and if it's really dirty do the outer edges of the lens first, discard the PEC PAD then do the whole lens with another PEC PAD with the drops of Eclipse finishing by lifting the PEC PAD off at the edge not the centre of the lens.

I got mine from eBay.

richard

Lostlabours
21st August 2014, 09:39 AM
A wet clean works wonders :D

http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/cameras/images/petzval04sm.jpg

http://www.lostlabours.co.uk/photography/cameras/images/petzval07sm.jpg

Ian

alexmuir
21st August 2014, 11:54 AM
It's not quite as bad as that!! I am confident that it will be improved. I have som PEC pads which I find to be very useful. I hope to get the work underway this evening.
Alex

alexmuir
21st August 2014, 08:19 PM
Lens cleaned and looking a lot better, although there seems to be quite a bit of coating loss on the inner surface of the rear group. I managed to remove the rear group, as suggested. This gave access to the rear of the front group via the shutter on 'T' setting. It's now back together, and I will try it out soon. Although it does 6x9, I'll probably use it for 6x6 as that's the max negative I can enlarge. Thanks for all the helpful suggestions and advice. The before and after shots in Ian's post are superb. I'm now looking for something similar, although there isn't much in old large format equipment on offer up here.
Alex.

Richard Gould
22nd August 2014, 06:50 AM
Alex, I doubt it's coating loss as, as far I am aware, the Ensar lens was un coated, at least, every sample I have seen, and I have seen a few, have all been uncoated, but they are no mean performers, they need stopping down to 5.6 or better and produce pretty good negatives, looking forward to hearing how it goes,
Richard

Lostlabours
22nd August 2014, 09:19 AM
I have a 107mm f3.8 Ensar which is un-coated in an Epsilon shutter, I'm not sure what camera it was off, but I bought a 420 off the same seller a few months later.

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8403/8754084161_b39601038e.jpg

In fact my Ensar is identical to a 105mm f3.8 Xpres the only difference is the Xpres is coated.

Ian

Richard Gould
22nd August 2014, 09:48 AM
It is the first Ensar that I have come across that is coated, certainly on both my Autorange and Commando the Ensar's are uncoated,with these lovely old cameras you can learn something new every day, perhaps that is why I love them so much
Richard

Lostlabours
22nd August 2014, 10:12 AM
It is the first Ensar that I have come across that is coated, certainly on both my Autorange and Commando the Ensar's are uncoated,with these lovely old cameras you can learn something new every day, perhaps that is why I love them so much
Richard

The coated lens is an Xpres, the Ensar is on the left. It may have been a special as it has a very low serial number 1007 and isn't listed in any of Ross Ensigns literature/adverts. Also it's marked 107mm, usually focal lengths are nominal.

Ian

Richard Gould
22nd August 2014, 11:28 AM
The coated lens is an Xpres, the Ensar is on the left. It may have been a special as it has a very low serial number 1007 and isn't listed in any of Ross Ensigns literature/adverts. Also it's marked 107mm, usually focal lengths are nominal.

Ian
Sorry Ian I can't read today
Every Xpress I have is coated, I have a 105 on my Selfix 820, as I said I believe they never coated the Ensar so when using them a lens hood is essential, but they are very capable lenses, and were used by Ensign for many years, I think they were the standard house lens until Ross took over and used their xpress, which I think is the better lens, having used both on different ensigns
Richard

Lostlabours
22nd August 2014, 12:04 PM
Houghtons used the Xpres lenses before WWII on some models along with the CZJ Tessar and Schneider Xenar as well as the Ensar.

They had a tie up with Aldis though through Butcher and also used Beck lenses. So the chances are that the Ensars could have been made by Ross, Aldis or Beck. Mine in the photo is definitely made by Ross.

Ian

alexmuir
22nd August 2014, 12:53 PM
Hi Richard and Ian. This is interesting information. The only surface on my lens that appeared to be coated was the inner face of the rear group. It has marks that are similar to coating loss as I have seen on other lenses that have had rough handling. If it's not a coating, it could only be dirt, I suppose. I'm inclined to leave it as is until I try it with film. What sort of hood is normally used with this type of lens? There doesn't appear to be a thread or other means of attachment.
Alex

Richard Gould
22nd August 2014, 02:03 PM
Alex, I have a few old slip on lens hoods that I have gathered over the years which fit my various lenses, often they have come with cameras that I have bought, most of these older folders don't have a thread they depend on slip on hoods/filters I would be inclined to try film testing nthe camera before doing any further cleaning as dirt/dust internally often won't make a difference to the performance of the lens, but if it does need a clean then proceed with caution, many of my cameras have what by today's standard ''dirty'' lenses but the end results are very sharp and clear indeed, in my years of using these cameras I have only had one lens that was bad, and that was not so much a dirty lens as bad cleaning, leaving a lot of cleaning marks on an inner surface and the lens gives a soft result, as if you have put a strong diffusing filter over the lens, it is sharp but soft, which can be beautiful with the right subject,
RICHARD

alexmuir
22nd August 2014, 04:05 PM
Thanks Richard. I will let you know how it performs.
Alex

Richard Gould
22nd August 2014, 04:54 PM
Alex one more word of advice, with the Episilon shutter never ever change from low to high speed, or vice versa, with the shutter cocked, you will ruin it, the Episilon is a fairly simple shutter, but the change from low to high with a cocked shutter is a definate no no, I speak from bitter experiance, the first collectable folding camera I ever had was a lovely ensign 16/20 selfix, working perfectly when it arrivied, and I still have some lovely negatives taken with it, then one day I went from a bright outside shot to a very dim inside shot,around 1/5 and the shutter was cocked, changed the speed, not knowing any better then, being used to ''modern'' cameras, it made a horrible noise and never worked again, I learnt the hard way and now only cock a shutter just before I take the pic
Richard

alexmuir
22nd August 2014, 06:40 PM
Thanks Richard. I will keep that in mind. It seems to be working fine. Now loaded and first two shots in the bag!
Alex

richardw
22nd August 2014, 07:07 PM
Alex one more word of advice, with the Episilon shutter never ever change from low to high speed, or vice versa, with the shutter cocked, you will ruin it, the Episilon is a fairly simple shutter, but the change from low to high with a cocked shutter is a definate no no, I speak from bitter experiance, the first collectable folding camera I ever had was a lovely ensign 16/20 selfix, working perfectly when it arrivied, and I still have some lovely negatives taken with it, then one day I went from a bright outside shot to a very dim inside shot,around 1/5 and the shutter was cocked, changed the speed, not knowing any better then, being used to ''modern'' cameras, it made a horrible noise and never worked again, I learnt the hard way and now only cock a shutter just before I take the pic
Richard

I'll bet Pani at Camera City can fix it for you. He has repaired two shutters for me, both needed parts making. He seems to be able to do anything. You might wait a while, as he is naturally very busy, but if he examines your shutter and says he can fix it, he can and does.

http://www.cameracity.co.uk/services

richard

Richard Gould
22nd August 2014, 08:11 PM
I'll bet Pani at Camera City can fix it for you. He has repaired two shutters for me, both needed parts making. He seems to be able to do anything. You might wait a while, as he is naturally very busy, but if he examines your shutter and says he can fix it, he can and does.

http://www.cameracity.co.uk/services

richard

I tried Newton and Ellis,and while they could have repaired it, it would have cost twice the price I paid for the camera, I have since replaced the camera, but changing speed range's like that does a lot of damage to the cam's in episilons, and makes them difficult to repair, but you livr and learn, I would not change shutter speeds on any old camera with the shutter cocked
Richard

Michael
22nd August 2014, 09:09 PM
I tried Newton and Ellis,and while they could have repaired it, it would have cost twice the price I paid for the camera, I have since replaced the camera, but changing speed range's like that does a lot of damage to the cam's in episilons, and makes them difficult to repair, but you livr and learn, I would not change shutter speeds on any old camera with the shutter cocked
Richard

...except for Zorkis etc. if you ever use them!

Richard Gould
23rd August 2014, 06:56 AM
I have a couple, never use them, too noisy
Richard

alexmuir
23rd August 2014, 10:48 AM
Film now processed and drying, but a bit of a disaster! I used the 6x6 setting, but didn't realise that this camera has a built in mask that needs put in place at the start. All the negatives are 6x9 overlapping each other. I suspect there may also be some form of light leak as well. It's difficult to be certain with the extent of the overlapping frames. One thing is certain, however, this Ensar has been coated. The front element shows the purplish tint when you see it in daylight. Looking into the lens, you can clearly see the damaged area on the inner surface. The lens serial is 37033. Perhaps it is a late model? I will give it another try with the masks in place to see if it is worth using. I will try to identify potential leaks first.
Alex

Steven
23rd August 2014, 10:59 AM
My light leak test:
Do you have access to a darkroom? A cupboard would do. Get a mini LED torch (even better if you can get some small enough, a couple facing in opposite directions, as the light is quite directional) and put them inside the bellows. Close the back up and turn the lights out.
Give your eyes a few minutes to adjust - then move the camera around in you hand and search for the pinholes!

Just be careful the torch can't scratch the rear lens element.
Remember to fire the shutter, too. The light leak might be the shutter not closing fully.

Can you post a pic of the lens coating damage?

Richard Gould
23rd August 2014, 02:06 PM
For checking bellows light leaks I have a small flash unit that I fire in the bellows in my darkroom, fire a few times and the intense beam of light will soon show up any leaky bellows, If the shutter is not quite shutting it will show on the negative as a dark small triangle in the middle of the negative.
Richard

Lostlabours
23rd August 2014, 04:31 PM
For checking bellows light leaks I have a small flash unit that I fire in the bellows in my darkroom, fire a few times and the intense beam of light will soon show up any leaky bellows, If the shutter is not quite shutting it will show on the negative as a dark small triangle in the middle of the negative.
Richard

I checked out an MPP MicroPress for someone which had a light leak that couldn't be spotted. A flash found it because of the high intensity, it was ever so slight and a torch or other lamp weren't enough even in the dark.

Ian

alexmuir
23rd August 2014, 09:19 PM
I will try out the tests to see if I can find the leak. I will try to post some pics of the lens to show coating loss. It will be tomorrow.....I've been enjoying the 1988 wedding anniversary wines today. We were given them last year, but have only got round to opening them now.
Alex

Steven
24th August 2014, 04:41 PM
I will try out the tests to see if I can find the leak. I will try to post some pics of the lens to show coating loss. It will be tomorrow.....I've been enjoying the 1988 wedding anniversary wines today. We were given them last year, but have only got round to opening them now.
Alex

The secret of a happy life is to get your priorities right.

Sounds like you are making a good shot at it :-)