Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free:   AG Photographic   The Imaging Warehouse   Process Supplies   RH Designs   Second-hand Darkroom Supplies  

Notices

Go Back   Film and Darkroom User > Equipment > Darkroom

  ***   Click here for the FADU 2015/2014 Yearbooks   ***

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 28th March 2021, 12:19 AM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Daventry, Northants
Posts: 8,968
Default Smiths Darkroom Timer - Removing the Front Glass ai

As some here will know pentaxpete offered the following darkroom timer for sale and I was the lucky buyer

It works fine and even the face still retains some luminosity in the figures which is amazing. However it appears as if the two hands( seconds and minutes) were once luminous at their tips but if they were then this luminosity has now been lost completely

Somewhere I still have, I think, some luminous tape which I could cut and try to stick to the hands' tips but I need to get the plastic front off to get to the hands

I have managed to prise it lose from its metal surround but cannot lever it over the metal edge of the lip.

Three screws seem to hold the clockwork in the back
so you might say that I simply remove the three screws and pull the clockwork out backwards. However as you will see from the attached link the start and stop lever and the lever to return the two hands to zero stick out the sides to prevent this.

One of these levers ( the start and stop one ) has a screw which appears to attach the lever to the rest of the start stop lever on the inside but removing this screw does nothing to release the part of the lever that stick through the casing

So hopefully someone else here has a similar clock and can hopefully say if the clear plastic front can be prised out but if not does anyone know enough to tell me how the clockwork can be removed from the back?

I have done a thorough search and there is practically nothing on this timer.

I attach a link that shows you what it looks and how it works but as far as helping with disassembly it is about as much use as a chocolate teapot

Here's the link:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKJE3VSYh1U

Thanks

Mike
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 28th March 2021, 07:54 AM
EdmundH EdmundH is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: North Norfolk
Posts: 394
Default

I'd say that the glass is definitely fitted from behind. Can you post a picture of the back , so I can see the movement?
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 28th March 2021, 08:53 AM
Keith Haithwa Keith Haithwa is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 76
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike O'Pray View Post
......One of these levers ( the start and stop one ) has a screw which appears to attach the lever to the rest of the start stop lever on the inside but removing this screw does nothing to release the part of the lever that stick through the casing ......
Mike, I have just taken mine apart and I can assure you that removal of this screw will release the outer part of the lever together with the spring that adds some movement resistance to the lever.

Then it's a matter of carefully 'wiggling' the mechanism out of the case. The clear plastic front of mine appears to be stuck in place but whether this is glued or not I can't tell and I don't want to risk breaking it by trying to take it out. I assume that you've realised that the wind up knob has a left-hand thread.

It is a real fiddly job geting it all back in, particularly the lever screw and spring, and care must be taken not to distort the clockwork structure as the 'reset to zero' mechanism is a bit delicate as I found out to my cost on another timer I took apart.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 28th March 2021, 12:26 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Daventry, Northants
Posts: 8,968
Default

Thanks Keith. Can I take it you have or had the exact same model? It certainly sounds from what you say that removing the clockwork is the only way to get to the hands

I did actually remove that screw attaching the stop/start lever extension that you see from the outside and clearly you are right this should allow you to wiggle the clockwork out but having removed the screw I found the extension lever could then be pushed forward by about 5mm max but not wiggled or pulled off

It may be that the danger of something going wrong and ruining the clock outweighs any benefit from trying to extract the clockwork

However with the clockwork still in position is it possible to clean/oil the mechanism in any way and which spindles need any oil and what's the best oil?

As I said the clockwork runs OK but nice to know if either lever and or certain spindles need the occasional oil. It all look pretty dry in there but on the other hand clocks are probably not meant to appear to have oil

The stop / start lever when stopped and started within a few seconds sometimes does start the clock again and needs the operation to be done again

The simple brake mechanism which is all it is, does instantly come away from the wheel it has braked but it is as there is a kind of a failsafe mechanism that you can't see that prevents near instant on/off operation. In normal use there would always be a few seconds or much longer anyway between stop and start again so in normal this aspect may never be one that is seen

Just a bit of curiosity on my part

Thanks for all your help so far, Keith and if you can supply any info to my further questions then I'd appreciate it

Mike
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 28th March 2021, 01:25 PM
Keith Haithwa Keith Haithwa is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 76
Default

Mike, I've taken mine apart and done a quick phone snapshot, I'll post it asap.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 28th March 2021, 02:00 PM
Nat Polton Nat Polton is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 758
Default

Once you have removed the screw indicated by the pencil, a bit of jiggling will allow the lever to be removed. With the top case screw and the two screws underneath removed the movement can be swung out of the case with the other lever acting like a hinge.
The plastic glass just falls out then.
If the clock is working fine do not be tempted to improve on the working.
You can oil the pivot holes whilst it is out of the case but do not put oil on any of the wheel and pinion teeth. Oily teeth attract dust and grit and will eventually wear them away.
Never, Never be tempted to give a clock a quick blast of WD40 just to help it along. I have seen a few that have been given this treatment and it does no good at all.
Genuine clock oil on the pivots but leave the rest alone if you are not familiar with clock repairing.
I used some Kenro luminous plastic tape on my darkroom light switch years ago. If it is the same as your tape it is quite thick and could snag the hands as they pass each other.
Give the clock a good run before you put it back in the case, just to make sure the hands do not snag.

Cheers.

http://www.film-and-darkroom-user.or...1&d=1616939903

http://www.film-and-darkroom-user.or...1&d=1616939903


http://www.film-and-darkroom-user.or...1&d=1616939903


http://www.film-and-darkroom-user.or...1&d=1616939903
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	SMITHS TIMER  a.JPG
Views:	393
Size:	96.0 KB
ID:	4128   Click image for larger version

Name:	SMITHS TIMER  b.JPG
Views:	319
Size:	104.0 KB
ID:	4129   Click image for larger version

Name:	SMITHS TIMER   c.JPG
Views:	305
Size:	74.5 KB
ID:	4130   Click image for larger version

Name:	SMITHS TIMER   d.JPG
Views:	335
Size:	86.6 KB
ID:	4131  
__________________
It will all be over by Christmas.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 28th March 2021, 02:14 PM
Keith Haithwa Keith Haithwa is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 76
Default

Here we go Mike. When you have removed the screw from the lever you have to pull the lever outwards against the spring so that the inner part of the lever clears the slot in the outer, then you have to wiggle the loose lever around to get it out of the slot and the timer casing. Reverse the operation to refit it.

When I disassembled mine fully just now the glass fell out so it obviously just held in place with the clockwork structure. Be very careful, the plastic is very thin and might be brittle with age.

BTW, the hands on mine are just painted red and black, no luminous stuff at all.

If your pivots look a bit gummed up it might be worth while using a small artists brush and IPA (or lighter fluid) to wash the old oil or grease out of them, letting them dry and then relube with sewing machine oil or some other very light oil.

Late edit: Ooops, It seems Nat beat me to it by a short head.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Timer.jpg
Views:	198
Size:	902.2 KB
ID:	4132   Click image for larger version

Name:	Timer Lever.jpg
Views:	189
Size:	249.4 KB
ID:	4133   Click image for larger version

Name:	Timer Lever-2.jpg
Views:	216
Size:	945.3 KB
ID:	4134  

Last edited by Keith Haithwa; 28th March 2021 at 02:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 28th March 2021, 08:00 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Daventry, Northants
Posts: 8,968
Default

Fantastic posts and shots, Keith and Nat. My connecting piece, once the screw has been removed, seems not to have enough room when compressing the spring as far as it will compress, to free itself from the lever to which it is connected. It isn't clear why but I am assuming that the external part of the lever has to be pulled down to the bottom of the slit to give it that extra room?

Maybe I was just too nervous of bending either or both the main part of the lever connected to the clock and the extension piece which sticks out of the clock

As far as oiling the pivots goes is it every pivot on which there are gears and do I simply drip some lighter fluid on the pivots to free them from gunge and then when dry re-oil?

What's the best way to apply lighter fluid or IPA and is either as good as the other?

Frankly I was about to decide to simply put the screws back and leave it but with the back off this afternoon I noticed that when applying the brake and taking it off again the clockwork is often reluctant to start so there may be gunge that has to be dissolved anyway so I fear it has become all or nothing so to speak

Clock oil isn't cheap but there we are

By the way I may have discovered why my hands have what I think are luminous ends compared to yours. Your faces look to have black printed numbers on the dials but mine has luminous ones so in my case no point in luminous numbers and hands that you can tell where they are in the dark

Many thanks again for both your efforts in helping. Without your help I'd be nowhere at best at worst could have ended up ruining the clock

Mike
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 28th March 2021, 08:23 PM
Keith Haithwa Keith Haithwa is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 76
Default

It's a close Mike but it will come off trust me. You also have to fiddle the loose lever out of the slot at an angle from the inside to get it out of the casing so the mechanism can be removed but again, it will come out.
Tiny drops of IPA or lighter fuel will help soak sticky lube out of the pivots and you need to keep mopping it up with a dry brush or cotton bud -there should only be a little but it will keep things clean. Just the tiniest drop of replacement oil is needed, I usually pick up a little drop on the end of a cocktail stick. As Nat said, don't go near any of the wheel or pinion teeth. If in doubt, leave it alone and just give it lots of exercise, it just might free it up a little. Hope this helps.
Reply With Quote
Reply
Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free:   AG Photographic   The Imaging Warehouse   Process Supplies   RH Designs   Second-hand Darkroom Supplies  

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Smiths Timer pentaxpete Sale or Wanted 5 17th March 2021 11:13 AM
Faulty Darkroom Timer Mike O'Pray Darkroom 12 15th June 2019 04:36 PM
Android Darkroom Timer Project ianbarber Darkroom 10 23rd December 2018 07:33 AM
Removing chemical stains from darkroom equipment cesare Darkroom 31 8th July 2012 11:21 AM
Smiths Timer George Swift Sale or Wanted 2 19th December 2010 07:52 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:59 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.