Film Wetting Agent - Technique

[Larry]

Hi all

I'm still having problems with drying marks left on my 35mm film dispite using Ilford Wetting Agent. Aim I doing something wrong with my technique.

It's only on 35mm negs regardless of film make. 120 is fine.

I wash my film in running water with either patterson force film hose into the developing tank or by taking the lid off the tank and just run water over the film for 20mins.

Whilst doing this, I get a clean jug and fill with 500m of filtered or normal tap water and add 2.5ml of wetting agent at 1:200. Let it stand for a couple of mins to dissolve any air bubbles. I use a syringe for careful measurement.

I then empty the paterson tank of water and pour in my wetting agent and let sit for 2 mins. Then take out the film and tried a no shake off of the reel, water dripping and strong shake till almost dry then hang up in clean area.

No matter how many attempts I try 35mm films always have water marks or spots when dry.

If I'm doing something silly please tell me, it's getting me frustrated.

Any tips of the correct procedure? would really appreciated. Even tried rewashing the film and going process again to no avail.

Thanks for any suggestion.

apxuser.

[Tony Marlow]

I have had this problem but there are two things I now do which seems to have cured the problem. I use de-ionised water with the rinse aid (I buy a big can from a motor spares shop) and I wipe the BACK of the film with a chammy leather dampened in the rinse aid water. When I got drying marks they always seemed to appear on the back of the film, not the emulsion side.
Tony

[Trevor Crone]

As Tony mentions water marks mostly occur on the upper surface of the film and not the emulsion side. Have you tried wiping the dry film surface with a microfibre lens cleaning cloth? This sometimes works if the marks are just light 'smears'.

Try your wetting agent with distilled or deionised water, if this doesn't cure the problem then you might like to try Rollei's RWA super concentrate wetting agent available from Silverprint. It's not cheap but lasts an age; diluted 1+1000. This is now my preferred method for all my films from 35mm to 8x10 sheets. I wrote an article about it for B&W Photography mag. a couple of years ago. It really does work

[Richard Gould]

I use tetenal mirasol wetting agent,soak my filjm for five minutes in solution, and shake it as dry as possible,and when I hang the film up to dry I wipe 35mm on the shiny side with a folded up sheet of kitchen roll, and I never have a problem.Richard

[PaulG]

Is there a possibility that you're getting foaming or bubbles formed when you pour the wetting agent into your Paterson tank and that these are somehow interfering with 'contact' between the wetting agent and the film? I used to add the wetting agent to the tank but changed my approach a while ago.

I still use Ilford wetting agent but dilute it fresh (working solution goes off quickly and starts growing things in my experience) into a tupperware box that's deep enough to take a spiral. When I've finished washing the film, I take the spiral out of the tank and lower it gently into the box, leave for about 30 s (no swirling or agitation of any sort) and then hang the film to dry. Fingers crossed, it seems to work ok. I don't used distilled or deionised water, but our tap water seems to be quite soft.

[Daud]

I use distilled water (cos I can get it here in Oman!) in a plastic food type container about twice the size of my tanks. I only use about 1ml of wetting agent (It only needs to break the surface tension of the water).
Take the film off the reel and drop into this container for about 60 sec; with constant movement of the film. Pull out and just let the excess water run off (I never touch the film….) then hang up to dry. Never a problem.
This brings me to using wetting agent in film tanks and leaving on the reel…. If you use plastic reels the wetting agent will form a film on the plastic over time and make the reels stick when trying to load film. (It took me ages to find this out with lots of expletives when trying to load 120 films)
To be honest, I think everyone has their own methods and will say ‘do this do that’ all I can say is try a method you are comfortable with and see how it goes.

David.

[Bob]

I stopped using wetting agent and now just let the film sit in deionised water for a couple of minutes before hanging up to dry. If I'm feeling adventurous I use a Paterson film squeegee - but always give it a good rinse in the DI water before use and when dry it is stored in a sealed jiffy bag. Many people will advise against this and they are right of course but, if you are careful to keep the squeegee clean, it works - I've never seen a scratch.

My film is hung to dry at room temperature either in the bathroom or in the darkroom, depending on which I am not going to be using for a few hours...

[Phil]

That sounds like a hell of a lot of wetting agent - I literally do 2 or 3 drops of Ilford in the same quantity of water. I know they recommend that dilution but it always gave me really mucky negs!
I actually gave up and used Ecover washing up liquid for a while (but I'm back on the Ilford again) and that worked fine too - what I would say though, is after you've soaked your film in the wetting agent, rinse it (still in the reel) really really well under running tap water; I also shake the reel (can only describe it as a downwards flick of the wrist without letting go) as agent can accumulate in the spirals and cause massive problems, even with rinsing it in running water. I do this a few times whilst rinsing it.
I always transport the film still in the reel, in the tank with water in it (stops dust adhering) to where I am going to hang the film (no running water in my darkroom you see . . .) and after I have hung it, use a good squirt of distilled water down each side of the film, just in case any Hairy Marys (technical term ) have attached themselves in the meantime.
Roger Hicks' advice of trying to hang the film at an angle sort of works pretty damn well too.
I also have an ioniser on in my darkroom, so dust is a problem of the past.
This gives me squeaky clean negs every time, and I use a variation of this with my 5x4's too - no problems.
Phil

[Bill]

I appear to have a similar but different problem. I use Ilfotol at the recommended dilution in a separate jug after experiencing foaming problems during development from wetting agent residue on the reels. My problem is that I am getting the occasional drying mark in the emulsion side of the film. This shows up as tear drop marks especially in the skies (isn't it always?). I avoid touching the film after final soak and have not been using the film squeegee. I am using tap water for the final soak, perhaps a change to de-ionised may help.

Any other ideas? I had this a number of years ago with FP4 (before Plus) and changed to Agfa film at that time. John Davies also had the same problem.

Bill

[Trevor Crone]

Originally Posted by BillMar

I appear to have a similar but different problem. I use Ilfotol at the recommended dilution in a separate jug after experiencing foaming problems during development from wetting agent residue on the reels. My problem is that I am getting the occasional drying mark in the emulsion side of the film. This shows up as tear drop marks especially in the skies (isn't it always?). I avoid touching the film after final soak and have not been using the film squeegee. I am using tap water for the final soak, perhaps a change to de-ionised may help.

Any other ideas? I had this a number of years ago with FP4 (before Plus) and changed to Agfa film at that time. John Davies also had the same problem.

Bill

Bill, this is often a result of drying the film too quickly before the water has had time to fully run off the surface.