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  #1  
Old 10th May 2022, 08:26 AM
Nat Polton Nat Polton is offline
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Default Slide Copying on Black and White Film

I recently inherited an Olympus Bellows and Slide Copying Attachment.

Looking at some old family slides I have decided to copy some onto black and white film. Then I can give out black and white prints to family members.

A single flash gun set on manual will be used for repeatable results at a
fixed distance.

In my fridge salad drawer are Ilford PanF+, FP4+ and HP5+.

Can anybody recommend one of these and any possible speed correction.

Cheers.
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Old 10th May 2022, 08:58 AM
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skellum skellum is offline
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Hi Nat.
I haven't done this before, but I have used a lot of PanF. It's naturally quite a contrasty film, and the slides you're copying may already be high contrast. Although it's a fine grain film it probably isn't best for this.
I'd be using FP4- lower contrast than PanF and finer grain than HP5.
Depending on home many slides you want to copy, and how much film you've got, I would do a test roll and bracket at +1, +1/2, and ISO 125.
I wouldn't go faster than 125 as the film certainly won't have got faster in storage.
Good luck, and no doubt somebody who has actually done this will be along soon.
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Old 10th May 2022, 01:53 PM
alexmuir alexmuir is offline
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I have only copied a colour transparency to B&W film once, but the purpose, and process was a bit different from your set-up. I do seem to recall, however, that Ilford Ortho film was suggested. It is now available in 35mm, and I’m sure there is also at least one other Ortho film available in 35mm. It may be worth investigating, before using film from your present stock. As far as I am aware, copying is usually done with a specialist film to obtain the best results.
Alex.


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Old 10th May 2022, 05:54 PM
Molli Molli is offline
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I've copied two Kodachrome Slides from the late 50s,early 60s. I used Fuji Neopan 400 (of no use to you now, unless you have a stash in the freezer &#128532 and an Ohnar Zoom Reverser attached to a Canon EOS Elan II (aka EOS 50).

In both cases I exposed one for mid-grey (metered blue sky/sunlit grass) and +1, +2. The first slide was of a bride's maid wearing a white dress with not embroidery, um, embossing? At any rate, there was detail to be held.
In both cases, I wound up printing the one stop overexposed image. As metered muddied up the whites and two stops over blew out the highlights completely.

You definitely don't want to be using a slow film as they're almost universally contrastier than their 400 speed counterpart. I would have thought Ortho film would have fallen into this category, particularly with its insensitivity to red. In the case of that bride's maid photo, she'd have wound up with black lips from her red lipstick. Also, the incredibly blue sky in the photo would have rendered nearly white.

Once upon a time there was low contrast duplicating film for copying slides to colour print film. I THINK there was a black and white equivalent, but I'm not sure.
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Old 12th May 2022, 02:36 PM
JOReynolds JOReynolds is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexmuir View Post
I have only copied a colour transparency to B&W film once, but the purpose, and process was a bit different from your set-up. I do seem to recall, however, that Ilford Ortho film was suggested. It is now available in 35mm, and I’m sure there is also at least one other Ortho film available in 35mm. It may be worth investigating, before using film from your present stock. As far as I am aware, copying is usually done with a specialist film to obtain the best results.
You will be working at 1:1 magnification and the extension will be double the standard focal length, so the film will be seeing a quarter of the normal brightness - allow a two-stop increase in exposure time.
As Skellum wrote, slide film is already contrasty and FP4, rated at ISO 40 and under-developed by about 15% in D-76, would give good negatives, if a little dense (which is what you need).
There is no need to use specialised film, Alex. Ortho film was once used to make release prints and copy negatives in the movie industry because it could be handled in safelighting. Don't use ortho film for colour originals - it will give awful skin tones. Before panchromatic film became available, Max Factor started the film makeup industry, striving to make red lips appear other than black, tanned skin look other than blotchy. Try looking at life through a cyan filter!
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Old 13th May 2022, 06:54 AM
Paulographic Paulographic is offline
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Be careful using a flashgun to illuminate slides unless evenly diffused. Some years ago I was searching for a copying attachment for my Nikon to copy slides of my student artwork on to colour print film. A local SH camera shop said they could get it done for me. They came back with a big bright spot in the centre of each print totally obscuring the detail. The shop owner refused to accept payment , or par the technician doing them.He suggested (what I already knew) mounting the camera on a tripod pointing at a window on a bright but overcast day and using TTL metering.
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Old 13th May 2022, 04:34 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOReynolds View Post
Don't use ortho film for colour originals - it will give awful skin tones. Before panchromatic film became available, Max Factor started the film makeup industry, striving to make red lips appear other than black, tanned skin look other than blotchy. Try looking at life through a cyan filter!
This is not relevant to the thread but may be interesting nonetheless and your quote above prompted my memory

I am sure I read somewhere that in the very early days of BBC TV just prior to the second world war, female announcers and actors had to wear green lipstick to stop the "black lips " effect

Mike
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Old 13th May 2022, 06:13 PM
Nat Polton Nat Polton is offline
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Talking

There is some interesting material here.
I think this weekend I shall bite the bullet and try things out, keeping plenty of notes.
There is an optional diffuser on the Olympus slide holder. I was thinking that just for good measure I will also try a translucent white brolly to fire the flash through for about fifty percent of my test shots, and direct flash for the others.
There are plenty of notes about exposure values in the Olympus instruction booklets.
Before putting the film in I am also going to try flash metering through the back of the camera. Never done that before and never heard of anyone else trying it.

Green makeup is a thing I have heard about before. They must have looked a right sight walking the corridors of the BBC studios. Mind you some of the make worn today is a real conversation stopper, and I haven't even mentioned the ladies yet.

Cheers all.
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Old 13th May 2022, 07:58 PM
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skellum skellum is offline
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I am sure I read somewhere that in the very early days of BBC TV just prior to the second world war, female announcers and actors had to wear green lipstick to stop the "black lips " effect

This is Completely off topic, but in the classic James Whale version of Frankenstein Karloff's make-up was green and (from memory) based on Lead. Very unpleasant but done to suit the Orthochromatic film of the day.
https://www.domestika.org/en/blog/53...r-turned-green
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Old 14th May 2022, 01:16 AM
JulioF JulioF is offline
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For getting B&W slides from your negatives I would rather recommend Kodak 5302 positive release film, do a contact print from your negs. Develop as if it were paper, for instance with Dektol. Did this many years ago.
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