Out of date film

[adelbridge]

Hello,

I'm a bit of a novice with B&W film developing etc and have recently been given several rolls of Neopan (1600 and 400). The films are several years out of date, (2006-2007) and I doubt that they have been stored in a fridge or similar.

Please can I ask if it is worth using?

I want to improve my technical knowledge and skills in developing for different film/scene contrasts etc mainly following John Blakemore's excellent black and white photography book. Whilst the idea of using old film for 'practising' seems sensible to me, I am concerned that should the film deteriorate significantly this would not be helpful.

Any advice would be most appreciated, thank you.

[Carl V]

There's no reason why you shouldn't use it. How a film is stored is important, but so long as it hasn't been kept near a radiator or in direct sunlight, you should be fine with it. I've developed black & white film in the past which had expired several years previously and have managed to make satisfactory prints out of it. The films in question had been kept in a drawer so it was well away from heat and light.

[Mike O'Pray]

Welcome to FADU Quality film such as made by Ilford, Kodak and Fuji are remarkably tough and if they were mine I'd certainly use them and expect good negs.

Both types may have lost a little speed. It depends on what developer you use but unless it is a slight speed increasing one such as Ilford DDX or Microphen, I'd be inclined to set the speed on your camera at 320 or 250 and maybe reduce development time by 10% from that recommended for the 400 speed.

Neopan 1600 has a true speed of about 800 to a 1000 max so I'd set this one at 800 max.If you need to set at 1600 because of the shooting conditions then expect to lose some shadow detail which might not be important if they are night shots where 1600 speed may be necessary.

When you process try and ensure that all liquids are within one degree centrigrade ideally. Fuji film is said to be more susceptible to micro reticulation than Kodak or Ilford so same temps are important.

Let is know how things turn out.

PS Tell us a bit more about yourself with a first name, if you will and you particular photographic interests in the intro section. It helps us help you with answers if we know such things.

Mike

[TonyMiller]

Good advice above but I think it depends. If you're doing the 'grey scale' test from John Blakemore's book - ie. trying to discover your personal film speed test etc. - then it may be worth using film that's in date. I would want to keep any variables to a minimum.

- Tony

[cliveh]

Originally Posted by Mike O'Pray

When you process try and ensure that all liquids are within one degree centrigrade ideally. Fuji film is said to be more susceptible to micro reticulation than Kodak or Ilford so same temps are important.Mike

Mike, are you a bit confused here, there is a difference between increased grain size with temperature rise and reticulation. Reticulation - the formation of a network of cracks or wrinkles in a photographic emulsion that occurs with extreme temperature changes.

[Mike O'Pray]

Clive, I think I am trying to say that it is said by a number of users of Fuji trad B&W film that it is particularly susceptible to changes in temp between dev, stop, and fix and to ensure that a form of what I have seen referred to as micro reticulation is avoided then maintaining all three liquids within 1 degree centrigrade of each other is advisable.

I suspect that for any form of reticulation to be detectible needs a greater temp difference than this but it is probably good processing to maintain a very tight control on all three temps. I certainly do after reading about others experiences with Fuji Neopan.

I think the users whose responses I have seen were only referring to temp change reticulation and not to coarser but consistent grain effects at say 22 or 24 degrees C where all liquide temps are close to each other

My only experience of other films susceptibility( or lack of it) was HP5+ when I was on my night school course. The processing taps in a fully lit room were being used so I went out into the printing darkroom to use the taps there. In the darkness I had failed to notice that I had turned on the hot tap for the wash between dev and fix. I managed to splash my hand with some water on the first dump and realised to my horror that I had rinsed with very warm water. Not dish water warm and in the 50s range but must have been way above say 38 as it was quite warm on my skin.

The result? Nothing at all I could detect in the way of reticulation but HP5+ is a very tough film.

I like Neopan 400 very much and keeping all temps to within 1-2 degrees C of each other is no great hardship.

Mike

[cliveh]

Mike, having never used this film I can’t speak from experience. Perhaps I’m just being pedantic about the definition of reticulation.

[MarkWalker]

adelbridge, hello, I happen to have some Neopan 400 and 1600 in 2 bulk film loaders which I forgot contained film and their expiry was 2005. If it's not too late for you I'll be developing some 400 in the next day or two and I'll post my comments, regards.

[Peter Fitz]

Originally Posted by TonyMiller

Good advice above but I think it depends. If you're doing the 'grey scale' test from John Blakemore's book - ie. trying to discover your personal film speed test etc. - then it may be worth using film that's in date. I would want to keep any variables to a minimum.

- Tony

I would also recommend using fresh film if doing the tests from Blakemore's book just to be safe.

[paulc]

I've been using Fuji Acros 100 recently (some of it, several years out of date). My temperature control is kinda sloppy once past the developer stage, and I have yet to experience any reticulation.
Dev, I aim to keep at around 20C, but stop, rinse, and fix are often 15-18C.