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  #21  
Old 17th December 2012, 05:06 AM
Stocky Stocky is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry S View Post
...................

So, I think I will happily shoot the rest of the project with the Pentax 35mm camera, using the f1.4 lens for the majority of it.

Terry S
I came to the same conclusion. As much as I enjoy the beautiful negatives from 6x6, in low light hand held work it's very hard to beat 35mm.
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  #22  
Old 17th December 2012, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les McLean View Post
The original speed of Delta 3200 was calculated using the then in house version of DDX which I understand was used in all of the in house film tests. The results were so good that Ilford released the developer on to the market and named it DDX.
Just for clarity...

From the Ilford Delta 3200 PDF datasheet

Quote:
DELTA 3200 Professional has an ISO speed rating
of ISO 1000/31º (1000ASA, 31DIN) to daylight.
The ISO speed rating was measured using ILFORD
ID-11 developer at 20°C/68ºF with intermittent
agitation in a spiral tank.
Film Delta 3200.pdf
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  #23  
Old 18th December 2012, 10:56 AM
Terry S Terry S is offline
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Yes, I agree with what's just been said, having read the fact sheet BUT Ilford still recommend using ISO 3200 as the speed IN CAMERA.

Terry S
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  #24  
Old 18th December 2012, 11:39 AM
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There was a big hoo ha over ilfords DD-X when it was released, which was after delta 100 and delta 400. DD-X works well with those two developers. The t-grain films benefit from using it because it gives the shadows a kick making the the toe much shorter and producing a much straighter curve with a slight speed increase. But for me it doesn't work well with delta 3200 above 1600 speed and even at 1600 the times ilford quote are too short. Many people say they need to use the next higher than recommended times with delta 3200.
So I think there was a fair amount of marketing hype when it was released which wasn't applicable to delta 3200 IMO.
If you need real speed with delta 3200 then Microphen is the best Ilford developer cos it gives much greater film speed than you will get with DD-X. But again I would add it comes at the price of significant grain especially with 35mm film.

Last edited by Argentum; 18th December 2012 at 12:03 PM.
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  #25  
Old 18th December 2012, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry S View Post
Yes, I agree with what's just been said, having read the fact sheet BUT Ilford still recommend using ISO 3200 as the speed IN CAMERA.

Terry S
And finally...

Ilford do NOT quote 3200 as an ISO speed. They quote it as an EI speed.
ISO speed means the speed which conforms to the ISO test which is something different and as the ilford datasheet says, for delta 3200 the ISO test was done using ID11 and the speed obtained was 1000 so the only ISO speed for delta 3200 is 1000. Ilford could have used DD-X or Microphen for the ISO test but they didn't. Had they done so they would have obtained approximately 1250 with DD-X and approximately 3200 with Microphen IMO from my testing.
I think because ilford were promoting DD-X as their t-grain film developer at the time of the release of delta 3200, the perception was that DD-X is the dev of choice for delta 3200 which IMO is not a good choice for obtaining a useable EI of 3200.

Incidentally I also tested delta 3200 with perceptol stock. I got an ei of 800 developed for 21 minutes at 20 deg C. That gives an 8 stop range from black to white.

As with all low light subjects the subject contrast may be very low and might require a greater amount of development. All depends on subject brightness range which is critical to know in advance of choosing the right development times if you want easily printable negatives..
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  #26  
Old 18th December 2012, 01:17 PM
Terry S Terry S is offline
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I only used Microphen years ago so can't comment...

But my recent trial with Ilford's ISO 3200 film, USED AT THAT SPEED and then developed in Ilford LC29 for the recommended speed at 20C at 1+19 dilution produced some very printable negs.

The negs were a bit denser than I usually prefer though and I would definitely compensate by about MINUS 20% dev times, when used again.

Also, it was the 120 version of it I used so the grain wasn't too noticeable at all.

Only thing that I did notice was that the shadow areas and the mid-tones were a bit bunched up, but for the speed needed when I used it, I was very happy with the results.

I will try to post some scans of same sized areas on the prints from different films taken on the day in due course.

Terry S
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  #27  
Old 18th December 2012, 02:57 PM
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I also tested delta 3200 using HC110 which is not disimilar to LC29 ( I think).
I got an EI of around 1600. Importantly I found that HC110 gave a long toe which means little shadow separation which equates to being bunched up as you put it.
I also had to use HC110 1+15 for 8 mins at 20 degC to obtain that which is pretty strong. And highlights were a bit dense. This equates to similar results you have found with LC29.
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  #28  
Old 18th December 2012, 04:48 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
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You've answered a question I was going to ask, Argentum, which was what speed might be obtainable with DDX and D3200 so thanks.

I think I used to use EI1600 with DDX and got pretty good negs as might be expected with an EI of 1250.

Interesting that Microphen gives an EI of 3200 which is great but I hesitate to use Microphen as I found DDX in 35mm to be grainy enough even with 5x7 prints

I have since switched to Xtol and normally use EI 1250 which based on the Xtol write-ups may be about the right speed but that is speculation on my part.

Anyone conducted tests of D3200's speed with Xtol?

Thanks

Mike
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  #29  
Old 18th December 2012, 05:03 PM
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With dd-x my tests resulted in the following dev time at a speed of 1600.

DD-X 1+4 18mins at 20 deg C.

because of the unusual curve shape this results in 9 stop subject range from black to white with 4 stops below metered value (with a spot meter) and 4 to 5 stops above.
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  #30  
Old 19th December 2012, 12:01 AM
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I'm never sure about reports of successfully pushed film until I know what the photographer actually did.

Years ago I was nearly persuaded into buying a case of very expensive developer that came in sealed glass ampoules. Its claim was that HP-4 (before HP-5 and HP-5+) could be exposed at EI 3200. My colleague demonstrated by setting 3200 on his Gossen Lunasix meter and photographing his office desk. He said "There will be a real speed increase and I'll prove it by metering the shadows. The midtones and highlights will take care of themselves...as always."

He then took a reading of the shadow under the dial type telephone on his desk, saw 1/30 @f2.8 on the meter, set that on his Leica and exposed the HP-4. He used the "magic" developer for the negative and then made a straight forward 8x10 gelatin-silver in the company darkroom. It was perfect with a nice run of detailed tones!

But I was suspicious and came back later with MY Lunasix meter set to 400 and took a reading off the fully illuminated grey face of his telephone. I got 1/30 @ f2.8! The speed increase to 3200 was an illusion created by the way he did the light metering. And I saved some money by not buying that fancy developer.
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