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  #1  
Old 13th October 2008, 01:12 PM
Alan Sleator Alan Sleator is offline
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Default 5 X 4 printing - glass neg carrier or not ?

Hello everyone,

I'm starting out in large format photography. Should I use a glass neg carrier to keep these large negs flat or not ? If so, should both glass plates be anti newton, or just the top one.

And finally, since I can't find any proper Durst glass, ( Laborator Multigraph) can I simply use normal AN glass and normal optical glass cut to the correct dimentsions ? The modern An glass I've seen now seems to come with a coating rather than the old concentric ring pattern. Looking through it also blurs the image.

Ah so many questions - so little understanding !!

Actually you may be amused to know, that having gone to extraordinary lengths to reinstate my darkroom for the first time in 15 years, I'm now printing like an idiot . The results are terrible ! I'm having to re-learn dev times, and paper grades - skills I used to take for granted. Still, it's terrific fun, nevertheless.

best wishes,

Alan.
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Old 13th October 2008, 01:24 PM
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B&W Neil B&W Neil is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Sleator View Post
Hello everyone,

I'm starting out in large format photography. Should I use a glass neg carrier to keep these large negs flat or not ? If so, should both glass plates be anti newton, or just the top one. .
Alan,

This is all a matter of opinion of course, and how cool your enlarger runs, but I have had no problems at all with glass less cariers in my De Vere 504 with 5x4 negs. You also get get less dust specs this way which is another advantage.

It sounds as if you are enjoying re discovering your skills in the darkroom. I had a similar problem after about a three lay-off which happened when we moved house and a new darkroom had to be built.

Cheers,
Neil.
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Old 13th October 2008, 02:17 PM
Les Meehan Les Meehan is offline
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I agree with Neil, 5x4 negs are usually stiff enough not to need glass carriers. However, if you are using 'hot' light then without glass the neg will usually 'pop' after a couple of seconds and this can change focus. Focus after the light has been on for a few seconds in this case.
Also, make sure you stop down the lens so that the depth of field covers any neg curvature (especially after 'popping') i.e. resist using the wider apertures (which is bad practice anyway).

If you use glass it is usually only needed above the neg since this is the direction of curvature. Newton's rings are a major issue so AN glass is preferred (coated sounds much better than etched).
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Old 13th October 2008, 03:01 PM
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I have never used a glass carrier for 5x4 (a set came with my enlarger). I don't think it helps for anything other than 35mm. Apart from that, trying to keep 80 square inches of glass (4 sides x 5"x4") free of dust is going to be a nightmare!
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Old 13th October 2008, 03:33 PM
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An glass goes on top of neg. Plain glass below.
print sharpness will be affected mostly by enlarger alignment, then optimum aperture and then negative flatness.
i.e. enlarger alignment is critical and that should be perfected first. Then test which aperture gives sharpest result and use only that aperture and then if you still have sharpness problems, try plain glass under the negative.
I never had a negative pop in my L1200 which has an internal cooling fan and is a diffusion enlarger.
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Old 13th October 2008, 04:21 PM
Dave miller Dave miller is offline
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Glad to hear you are enjoying the re-learning curve Alan.
I use a glazed carrier for 5x4, in fact I also use the same carrier for medium format as well. The glass is the Durst set that came with the enlarger. I do not have any problem with dust, I use an anti-static brush which may, or may not help. Since the carrier is closed almost all of the time the surface to be kept clean are the same as for an open negative, or am I missing something?
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Old 13th October 2008, 05:15 PM
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Trevor Crone Trevor Crone is offline
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I also use a glazed negative carrier and do not have a problem with dust. I use this carrier for all formats from 135 to 4x5. Like Dave the use of an antistatic brush, canned air and Paterson's Proclens keeps the glasses spotless.

If you get the results you are after with the use of glassless masks then all well and good, there is certainly no need to change over to a glass carrier.

When I had my Durst M800 I did a test with both 135 and 120 film; glass vs. glassless. The glass carrier gave me sharper edge to edge images so I've stayed with this method ever since.

Nice to hear you are back in the fold Alan, long may it continue. Once you get all these practicalities under your belt you will enjoy the photography even more
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Old 14th October 2008, 05:53 PM
Alan Sleator Alan Sleator is offline
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Thank you everyone. I must pay tribute to the welcoming tone of all of the posts on this forum. There's a natural warmness and friendliness about the comments which suggests a strong sense of community.

Best wishes,

Alan.
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Old 14th October 2008, 05:55 PM
Dave miller Dave miller is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan Sleator View Post
Thank you everyone. I must pay tribute to the welcoming tone of all of the posts on this forum. There's a natural warmness and friendliness about the comments which suggests a strong sense of community.

Best wishes,

Alan.
That's nice to hear Alan.
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  #10  
Old 26th January 2009, 04:20 PM
Richard Gould Richard Gould is offline
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Personally I prefer to use glassless negitive carriers for all formats,I get good sharpness and I don't have to spend so much time ''spotting'', not one of my favorite passtimes, but I agree thjat it is a matter of personal choice Richard.
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