Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free:   AG Photographic   Keyphoto   The Imaging Warehouse   Process Supplies   RH Designs   RK Photo   Second-hand Darkroom Supplies   Silverprint Ltd

Notices

Go Back   Film and Darkroom User > Colour Work > Colour film

  ***   Click here for the FADU 2015/2014 Yearbooks   ***

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 9th May 2020, 09:19 AM
John King John King is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: County Durham
Posts: 2,299
Default RA4 printing with Tetenal - A warning!

I have recently had to change my RA4 baths in my Nova processor because of under replenishment. The replenishment rates were not given in my 5 litre kit so on advice from Tetenal they advised me about 10cc per 10x8 print would be adequate - WRONG!

Since then the company has undergone changes and the new RA4 kits are different. That 10cc replenishment may have been OK for the old previous formula, but that has now been changed to make it odourless.

The instructions in the new kit I am using states that a 5 litre kit will be sufficient to print approx. 230 10 x 8 prints which equates to a replenishment rate of slightly over 20cc per print, a significant difference. This also applies to the bleach fix as well.

With this increase in replenishment volume makes the Tetenal kit which was already pro rata, roughly twice the price of the Kodak Ektacolour RA4 20 litre developer and Blix 20 litre bought separately. Now double the price again because the replenishment rate for the Kodak is still 10cc per each 10x8 sheet of paper.

Once this Tetenal kit is finished I am going back to Kodak.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 9th May 2020, 01:47 PM
photomi7ch's Avatar
photomi7ch photomi7ch is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: East Midlands
Posts: 2,343
Default

Thanks for the update.
__________________
Mitch

http://photomi7ch.blogspot.com/

If you eliminate the impossible whatever remains no matter how improbable must be the truth.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 9th May 2020, 02:52 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Daventry, Northants
Posts: 7,777
Default

I wonder if this is connected to the "death and phoenix like revival of Tetenal? I have difficulty keeping up with all the posts that a thread about this on Photrio resulted in but it would seem that Tetenal has changed a few chemicals since it revival and if I recall correctly it made chemicals for Kodak where HC110 for one underwent changes

If this is the case then key to this might be whether Kodak RA4 chemicals will have to change

Despite the so-called revival in film that we are allegedly in the middle of, there does still seem to be worrying signs

Mike
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 9th May 2020, 08:00 PM
John King John King is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: County Durham
Posts: 2,299
Default Kodak RA4

According to the last bottles of Kodak RA4 Ektacolor the place of manufacture was China. Tetenal did not have a hand in it, nor do I think they will.

As it happens I much prefer Ektacolor rather than Tetenal as it seems to be far more stable and of course economic in use. By my rough calculations comparing the average cost of 4 x 5 litre kits of Tetenal with 20 litres of developer and blix from Kodak, then factor in you need only half the quantity to replenish, that works out around 4 times cheaper. It is a no brainer really.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 13th November 2020, 11:54 PM
John King John King is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: County Durham
Posts: 2,299
Default Kodak Ektacolour RA4

I had forgotten about this post but now I am back using the Kodak RA4 I can say the odour from the Kodak version is a lot less than it used to be. Not quite odour free, but still less.

I have the filtration adjusted to my requirements for the Kodak RA4 and only have to change this if I increase or decrease the exposure of the paper. It is so very much more stable.

Also with the Kodak chemicals. I get much cleaner whites therefore an apparent increase in contrast.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 23rd November 2020, 07:37 PM
John King John King is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: County Durham
Posts: 2,299
Default Colour developing anomaly

It is not very often that I am stumped for an answer with every day colour negative developing. For past few C41 films I have developed, at odd intervals there has been uneven developing on the edges between frames. On a 36 exp film I would think there would be nor more than 3-4 frames affected.

It is always on the leading edge of the film, i.e. the edge nearest to the take up spool when it is in the camera. How it shows is when the film is scanned, the positive shown on the screen after scanning has a feathered edge starting as dense as the space between each frame but rapidly getting less obvious over 2-3mm where it just fades to the rest of the normally exposed frame.

It isn't the scanner either because it is visible on the film if held up to the light.

It cannot be shutter bounce because it is a vertical travel shutter and in any case the effect would be the opposite. I first noticed this on one of my Minolta slr's (horizontal shutter operation) and latterly on two of my Nikons. Nor does it happen with black and white film which I always process using the inversion method.

The film is developed using a JOBO rotary processor, but if this were the cause of the problem why are only just a small fraction of the frames affected.

If you can suggest a solution I would love you to share it.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 23rd November 2020, 08:23 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Daventry, Northants
Posts: 7,777
Default

John I am clueless but just so I can be clear what have the past few C41 films been? Is it always the same or nearly the same 3-4 frames on each and so far none of the films have been free of this

Is it 35mm only? Unless something is happening to those frames on the same area on the developing reel or reels if you use different tanks and reels then I am unsure how to separate a developing problem from a manufacturing problem.

However the answers to some of my questions might be pointers towards certain causes

On a practical level will these feathered edges show on the prints?

Thanks

Mike
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 23rd November 2020, 08:29 PM
John King John King is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: County Durham
Posts: 2,299
Default Colour spread

Hi Mike. No it is perfectly random not the same frame every time. I don't know about any other size than 35mm but it is only colour never on B&W.

I have hopefully managed to get one where it is a bit more obvious. Ignore the lighter area in the sky that was my deliberate doing to emphasise the problem. The black strips at either end are the film frame gaps.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Colour banding.jpg
Views:	17
Size:	319.6 KB
ID:	3925  
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 25th November 2020, 07:16 PM
John King John King is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: County Durham
Posts: 2,299
Default Possibly a solution

I think I may have found the answer.

I printed one of the negatives affected in the darkroom and there was no sign of any edge problem involving discolouration. As much as I hope not, it looks as if it is my Nikon Scanner This will account for it being random and only on the shorter edge which is the lead edge as it goes into the scanner.

Oh well it is 17 years old so it has had a good life.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 25th November 2020, 07:29 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Daventry, Northants
Posts: 7,777
Default

That's looks to be the answer. It is amazing how often on another forum where hybrid processing is the king that scanning or scanners turn out to be the problem

I suspect that in the new world of hybrid any scanner 17 years old would produces the sentiment that it deserves to be in the British Museum as part of the "early industrialisation artefacts"


Mike
Reply With Quote
Reply
Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free:   AG Photographic   Keyphoto   The Imaging Warehouse   Process Supplies   RH Designs   RK Photo   Second-hand Darkroom Supplies   Silverprint Ltd

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Warning Vit-C powder loses its potency. GoodOldNorm Chemical formulae 7 28th September 2019 09:17 PM
Poundland 200 ISO film - a warning John King Colour film 10 30th November 2015 03:27 PM
Warning photomi7ch Feedback and forum matters 2 29th December 2009 01:19 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.