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Old 22nd March 2021, 01:43 PM
Terry S Terry S is offline
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Default Finally, I think I've found a good spotting medium

Well, after trying umpteen different inks and paints, for spotting my b/w prints, I think that I may have found something that actually does the job and is neutral in colour and tone, even when heavily diluted!

As usual, it's not so good on RC prints, but definitely, whilst taking ones time, it does seem to work on FB prints.

It's as black as you can get, and is easily diluted to make lighter shades AND you get a HUGE amount for your money!

What am I talking about? Chinese ink sticks.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_f...Desc=0&_sop=15

I could be wrong, but I think that this is what is mentioned in books about what Weston used, with gum Arabic, to retouch his glossy prints?

For the price, give it a try.

To think I might even come to enjoy spotting.

Terry S
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Old 22nd March 2021, 02:38 PM
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BuzzNL BuzzNL is offline
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This sounds interesting! For this little money it's well worth a try.
How bad / well does it work on RC prints, also compared to other methods?
Does it stick (no pun intended ) to RC paper at all?
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Old 22nd March 2021, 04:52 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuzzNL View Post
This sounds interesting! For this little money it's well worth a try.
How bad / well does it work on RC prints, also compared to other methods?
Does it stick (no pun intended ) to RC paper at all?
Yes good questions. I also wonder if all RC surfaces are the same or is the likes of Ilford Pearl and the very matt surface called Satin easier to spot?

Mike
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Old 22nd March 2021, 07:53 PM
John King John King is offline
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Default Spotting Resin Coated

Have you tried spotting resin coated when it is slightly damp. The RC emulsion will take a spotting dye easier than a dry print. I have been using it for years with RA4 colour paper as well.

My spotting inks/dyes are actually digital printer dyes from a 5 colour cartridge and one black. They actually work very well and with the 5 colours you can mix virtually any shade you wish.

To get the colour/shade of grey match I let the print dry fully then wet it and wipe it dry immediately and do the spotting straight away.
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Old 23rd March 2021, 01:36 PM
Terry S Terry S is offline
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Wow, that's a lot of questions and points to think about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BuzzNL View Post
How bad / well does it work on RC prints, also compared to other methods?
Does it stick (no pun intended ) to RC paper at all?
I've only tried it out briefly Buzz, but have been quite impressed by the colour and lack of colour shift from black. I found it to work about the same on RC papers, but I need to sit down and try it on a variety of different toned areas to see how well I can get it to match. I also want to see if it is noticeable when the paper is looked at an angle, to see if it soaks in or sits on the surface.

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Originally Posted by Mike O'Pray View Post
Yes good questions. I also wonder if all RC surfaces are the same or is the likes of Ilford Pearl and the very matt surface called Satin easier to spot?

Mike
I've only tried it on RC pearl and FB matt so far Mike, but I was going to make some prints with RC satin, in my next printing session, so I should have some test prints with this surface to try it out on soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John King View Post
Have you tried spotting resin coated when it is slightly damp. The RC emulsion will take a spotting dye easier than a dry print.

My spotting inks/dyes are actually digital printer dyes from a 5 colour cartridge and one black.
I always dampen the area that I'm about to spot John, following recommendations on the Spot Tone inks info sheet and helpfully, the bottles of ink also came with a small sponge to use. One other way I haven't tried, is to carefully hold the print over a boiling kettle, once retouching is finished. This is to supposedly help the colours soak in to the surface. I believe that this way of working is also recommended to get a better gloss on FB glossy papers?

As for trying black printer inks, I've tried the ones used in my printer and even bought a few samples of high end printer black inks, which are used in the more expensive printers. I found whatever the price, when diluted even slightly, they became shades of dark blue, rather than staying black or grey tones.

Well, it seems I have a bit more testing to do, but will report back when I've done some more.

Terry S
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Old 23rd March 2021, 03:14 PM
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BuzzNL BuzzNL is offline
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The lack of color shift sounds promising.

I've only ever spotted one or two prints in my short darkroom history, which I did with a very fine tipped black permanent marker.
That gives me only one shade (pitch black) and it has a slightly reddish/orange glow to it when light reflects off of it on Pearl paper.
It got the job done pretty decently but was far from perfect ofcourse.

I didn't have anything else at hand (I expected the color cast beforehand), but ever since I found myself cleaning the negatives and waffing the paper again and again, making re-prints until I'm happy.
The other day though, I had a scratched negative which I could not print without markings. Those prints would definitely benefit from proper spotting.

I'll order myself a stick and some very fine brushes and give it a try as well!
How is this ink best used for spotting; I understood that for Calligraphy use you're supposed to grind some material off of it and mix that with water. Is that also how you use it for spotting, or do you simply stroke the wet brush on the stick like with those dry-spot cards?
Perhaps it will be self-explanatory once I'd try it myself though.
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Old 24th March 2021, 12:57 PM
Terry S Terry S is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuzzNL View Post
The lack of color shift sounds promising.

I'll order myself a stick and some very fine brushes and give it a try as well!
How is this ink best used for spotting; I understood that for Calligraphy use you're supposed to grind some material off of it and mix that with water. Is that also how you use it for spotting, or do you simply stroke the wet brush on the stick like with those dry-spot cards?
Yes Buzz, the lack of colour shift is the main reason that I mentioned it.

As for the way to use it, I'm sure there are many, but I do almost as you say. I wet a brush heavily and then run this over the stick to pick up some colour. I then put it into a paint pallet (although I tried it on the back of a scrap RC test strip as well, which worked), which has a small amount of water in / on it. Then treat it as you would inks etc. by taking some of this colour and make another more diluted patch of colour etc. I hope this makes sense?

And of course, there is the cost, which is much less than some of the inks being sold, none of which I have really got on with colour wise.

I also yesterday had another go at spotting, as like most I am far from an expert at it. FB Art 300 was a doddle to spot first time but RC pearl took a little longer, but I got there. As I'm getting a little bored of the pearl surface at the moment, I'm going to start printing on RC satin and FB matt, a lot more, so I will report how it goes with these two surfaces when I've tried.

Terry S
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Old 24th March 2021, 02:31 PM
John King John King is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry S View Post
As for trying black printer inks, I've tried the ones used in my printer and even bought a few samples of high end printer black inks, which are used in the more expensive printers. I found whatever the price, when diluted even slightly, they became shades of dark blue, rather than staying black or grey tones.

Well, it seems I have a bit more testing to do, but will report back when I've done some more.

Terry S
There will be always a slight shift in colour whatever medium you use when it is diluted. You have to experiment by mixing a small amount of another colour, red or magenta will make it slightly purple but yellow usually works. Small amount at first and increase it to get the tone you want.
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Old 25th March 2021, 08:55 AM
Keith Haithwa Keith Haithwa is offline
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I am puzzled as to why some find that spotting on RC paper different to spotting on FB paper.
As Ilford have stated, the polythene coating (it's not a resin) is applied to the paper base before it is coated with emulsion so spotting is done on the emulsion for both types of paper.
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Old 25th March 2021, 01:05 PM
Terry S Terry S is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Haithwa View Post
I am puzzled as to why some find that spotting on RC paper different to spotting on FB paper.
I don't know the reason why it is so Keith, but as many will tell you, for whatever the reason is, it is DEFINITELY much easier to spot a FB print than it is an RC one.

I've been trying to improve my skill at this over the last few days and I can spot an FB print almost with the first or second touch up, but RC? Well that can take half an hour plus before I get even close. The inks or whatever, just seem to soak into FB print emulsion straight away, whilst it doesn't with RC.

The only way to understand this is to have a go on the two different papers oneself.

Terry S
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