Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free:   AG Photographic   The Imaging Warehouse   Process Supplies   RH Designs   Second-hand Darkroom Supplies  

Notices

Go Back   Film and Darkroom User > Monochrome Work > Monochrome printing techniques

  ***   Click here for the FADU 2015/2014 Yearbooks   ***

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 13th January 2021, 09:00 PM
Martin Aislabie's Avatar
Martin Aislabie Martin Aislabie is online now
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Stratford-upon-Avon, England
Posts: 2,080
Default Need a harder print than Grade 5 ?

I am trying to do a high key series of prints and have need to try of a harder print than G5 will give me.

I am using Ilford MGFB paper with Ilford MG Dev at 1+5 for 3.5 mins (the print seems to reach finality at 3 min - so a bit longer for print to print consistency).

Has anyone any suggestions ?

One of my own was to consider trying to mix my own Beers Two Sol'n variable contrast developer and mixing up the developer to a high contrast solution.

Any thoughts/experiences with this ?

Thanks

Martin
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 13th January 2021, 10:45 PM
MartyNL's Avatar
MartyNL MartyNL is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: based in The Netherlands
Posts: 3,341
Default

Hi Martin, have you thought about negative intensification in order to boost contrast?

I haven't tried it myself but it could offer an effective solution to your problem.

Personally, I find condenser enlargers add a 1+ contrast grade, if that option is available to you.
__________________
MartyNL

“Reaching a creative state of mind thru positive action
is considered preferable to waiting for inspiration.”
- Minor White, 1950
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 14th January 2021, 06:16 AM
Uwe Pilz's Avatar
Uwe Pilz Uwe Pilz is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Location: Leipzig, Germany.
Posts: 354
Default

You may combine the following things:
- use a grade 5 filter combined with maximum magenta filtering
- use a high contrast developer. If using your usual dev, dilute it as less as possible.
- shorten the exposure and lengthen the developing time as long as possible
- Increase contrast of the negative by Selen toning

Combining all of this you should gain at least one grade.
--
Uwe
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 22nd January 2021, 10:11 PM
Martin Aislabie's Avatar
Martin Aislabie Martin Aislabie is online now
Friend
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Stratford-upon-Avon, England
Posts: 2,080
Default

Hi guys

Thanks for the replies - they have given me some useful ideas.

I have had a look through my Darkroom Cookbook where there is a short section on Negative Intensification.

I don't fancy giving Chromium Intensifier a go as one of the main ingredients is hydrochloric acid and the other potassium dichromate - both of which are hazardous.

However, it says Ansel Adams used Selenium Toner to intensify some of his negatives at a 1+2 solution for 5 minutes - which sounds pretty easy - so I'll give it a go let you know.

I also still fancy having a go with Beers Two Solution variable contrast developer and mixing up the developer to a high contrast solution.

The Darkroom Cookbook has the recipe and Firstcall have all the chemicals available.

I remember the keeping properties of the made up solutions as being very poor, so I'll need to get myself set and ready to go, if I want to try it out.

Thanks for your help.

Martin
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 22nd January 2021, 11:22 PM
SanMiguel SanMiguel is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Portstewart, Northern Ireland
Posts: 341
Default

I’m with Uwe on this. Recently I’ve been using Ilford Delta 3200 but have had very low contrast negs (using Ilford’s recommended times). My probe tells me grade 5 is up to 2 grades too low, but I find if I shorten the exposure by up to 2 stops & let it develop for the full 3 mins (Multigrade developer 1:9 and Ilford Classic fibre) I actually get very acceptable prints.
Good luck!
Michael
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 23rd January 2021, 12:47 AM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Daventry, Northants
Posts: 8,968
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SanMiguel View Post
I’m with Uwe on this. Recently I’ve been using Ilford Delta 3200 but have had very low contrast negs (using Ilford’s recommended times). My probe tells me grade 5 is up to 2 grades too low, but I find if I shorten the exposure by up to 2 stops & let it develop for the full 3 mins (Multigrade developer 1:9 and Ilford Classic fibre) I actually get very acceptable prints.
Good luck!
Michael
An interesting method, Michael. So you mean that you shorten the exposure of the paper under the enlarger by 2 stops. How does this actually work? By that I mean that if I were to attempt this with say a 5x7 print then my exposure of say 10 -12 secs might be reduced to 3 secs?

Have I got this 2 stop reduction right?

Thanks

Mike
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 23rd January 2021, 08:59 AM
David Lingham's Avatar
David Lingham David Lingham is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: cardiff
Posts: 460
Default

Martin have you thought about trying lith. It might give you more contrast.
__________________
David Lingham

www.davidlingham.uk
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 23rd January 2021, 09:55 AM
Martin Rick Martin Rick is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 111
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Aislabie View Post
Hi guys

Thanks for the replies - they have given me some useful ideas.

I have had a look through my Darkroom Cookbook where there is a short section on Negative Intensification.

I don't fancy giving Chromium Intensifier a go as one of the main ingredients is hydrochloric acid and the other potassium dichromate - both of which are hazardous.

However, it says Ansel Adams used Selenium Toner to intensify some of his negatives at a 1+2 solution for 5 minutes - which sounds pretty easy - so I'll give it a go let you know.

I also still fancy having a go with Beers Two Solution variable contrast developer and mixing up the developer to a high contrast solution.

The Darkroom Cookbook has the recipe and Firstcall have all the chemicals available.

I remember the keeping properties of the made up solutions as being very poor, so I'll need to get myself set and ready to go, if I want to try it out.

Thanks for your help.

Martin
Selenium toner is also not completely non-hazardous and what our grandfathers used was uranyl nitrate. I believe Kodak used to recommend it as a uranium toner many years ago.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 23rd January 2021, 11:01 AM
SanMiguel SanMiguel is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Portstewart, Northern Ireland
Posts: 341
Default

That’s correct, Mike. My timer allows me to reduce the suggested times in fractions of an f-stop and I do a test strip first, but about 2 full stops works for me, for the given paper/developer combination already mentioned.
This may just be something that works for my set-up so I can’t guarantee it will work for you but I thought I’d mention it as something perhaps worth trying.
Rgs,
Michael


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike O'Pray View Post
An interesting method, Michael. So you mean that you shorten the exposure of the paper under the enlarger by 2 stops. How does this actually work? By that I mean that if I were to attempt this with say a 5x7 print then my exposure of say 10 -12 secs might be reduced to 3 secs?

Have I got this 2 stop reduction right?

Thanks

Mike
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 23rd January 2021, 11:56 AM
Nat Polton Nat Polton is offline
Friend
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 758
Default

Mention has been made of making lith negatives, I made quite a few in the past.
If these extreme contrast prints are acceptable, have a look at the bromoil process as well.
There are quite a few excellent detailed articles about bromoil on the web. Quite a few on Youtube as well.
Cheers.
__________________
It will all be over by Christmas.
Reply With Quote
Reply
Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free:   AG Photographic   The Imaging Warehouse   Process Supplies   RH Designs   Second-hand Darkroom Supplies  

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
ilfobrom galerie grade 2 big paul Photography in general 17 8th November 2016 07:09 PM
grade 5 printing Alan Clark Monochrome printing techniques 11 3rd July 2013 08:33 PM
split grade printing Ian Marsh Monochrome printing techniques 2 18th February 2011 12:48 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 04:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.