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  #1  
Old 30th April 2022, 11:51 AM
Terry S Terry S is offline
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Default Washing time for RC prints

For a good while, I have always felt that I over wash my RC prints, on the principal that it's better to do too much, than not enough.

So reading a page on the Ilford website has opened my eyes and goes to show that there are still things to be learnt.

They state that RC prints can be washed in still water in a tray, with agitation, for 15 seconds at a time, and when using three sets of water. This is way less time and water than I currently use and is definitely much quicker!!

Being on a water meter, any way to save water is a bonus.

Read the second column and at the top right bit of text, 'RC Papers'.

https://www.ilfordphoto.com/wp/wp-co...Wash-Water.pdf

Anyone else been over washing?

Terry S
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Old 1st May 2022, 07:14 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is online now
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The Ilford para:"RC Papers
When dish processing a minimum of 30sec in vigorous
fresh running water is required. It is also possible to use a sequence of three trays with still water in. Wash for 15 sec in each, with agitation. Change the water in the trays after each session.

I wonder what constitutes vigorous running water I use a separate Nova wash slot through which fresh water runs but at a fairly leisurely pace i.e. not a "fill the kettle" force

I just had a feeling that I had read somewhere that Ilford recommended 2 minutes so I checked the sheets on RC paper processing and here it is:

WashingTemperature (C/F) Time(sec)
Fresh, running water Above 5/41 120
When it is important to obtain a print in the
shortest possible time, vigorously wash ILFORD
resin coated papers for 30 seconds in running water, so it looks as if vigorous may be defined as a tap running at say a fast fill level in the case of 30 secs and that's a minimum time but 2 mins in a more leisurely flow

It might be that at best 30 secs vigorous equates to 2 mins leisurely in terms of usage and at worse 30 secs vigorous is actually more water

I think I'll stick to 2 mins.

I wonder if this time of 2 mins decreases as the cold water temp rises such as might be the case in late spring, summer and early autumn?

In which case there may be a case for saving some water in the warmest 4 months of the year by reducing the 2 mins?

Anyone seen any articles on the effect of higher washing temps for paper?

Thanks

Mike

Mike
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  #3  
Old 1st May 2022, 08:58 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is online now
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PS I have asked the question of Ilford re any studies on the time reducing effect, if any, on washing RC paper

I'll let you know its reply when I get it

Mike
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Old 1st May 2022, 09:19 PM
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Martin Aislabie Martin Aislabie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry S View Post
For a good while, I have always felt that I over wash my RC prints, on the principal that it's better to do too much, than not enough.

So reading a page on the Ilford website has opened my eyes and goes to show that there are still things to be learnt.

They state that RC prints can be washed in still water in a tray, with agitation, for 15 seconds at a time, and when using three sets of water. This is way less time and water than I currently use and is definitely much quicker!!

Being on a water meter, any way to save water is a bonus.

Read the second column and at the top right bit of text, 'RC Papers'.

https://www.ilfordphoto.com/wp/wp-co...Wash-Water.pdf

Anyone else been over washing?

Terry S
Terry - I think we all over-wash

We know we all do - what we don't know is how short we can wash for before it is too little - so we settle for safe rather than sorry.

I'm sure if you or I were motivated we could buy some residual hypo tester and run a series of tests with both paper and film to check how much/how little washing you could get away with.

However, we would also need to do a significantly significant sample size in each condition (30+) and at a range of water temperatures.

Unsurprisingly, most of cannot be bothered, so we err on sufficient washing + lots more.

But, it is worth reading the data sheet from Ilford just to remind each and every one of us just how much we are over washing.

Martin
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Old 2nd May 2022, 12:04 AM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Aislabie View Post

We know we all do - what we don't know is how short we can wash for before it is too little - so we settle for safe rather than sorry.

I'm sure if you or I were motivated we could buy some residual hypo tester and run a series of tests with both paper and film to check how much/how little washing you could get away with.


Martin
Martin a man called Greg Davis did a Youtube video on both the Ilford and Kodak film washing methods which I found quite interesting and worth a look. His YouTube site is called the Naked Photographer

Here is the latest video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWT2...ARPoQ&index=52

He did in fact show an earlier video on this to which he refers. This was the video that he placed on Photrio and for which he received a lot of attacks which in my opinion were unjustified. As a result he left Photrio and removed all his videos from that forum

Anyway I present this should it be of interest to anyone

Mike
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Old 2nd May 2022, 08:27 PM
John King John King is offline
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Because I am Lord of All I Survey in my house I can take certain liberties.

My washing for prints take place in the bathroom. The wet prints fresh from the fixer are first washed over the bath with the reverse side first using the shower head to direct water onto the print.

The print is then 'stuck' to the wet tiled wall with the image facing outwards and similarly washed for around 15-20 seconds using cold water. they are then then peeled off and stacked to dry.

This applies to both mono and colour prints. If I have more than one print to wash several can be done at once so saving water.

I have never had a problem with poor washing, or staining of the tiles or the bath.
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Old 8th May 2022, 08:38 AM
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PanFrank PanFrank is offline
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The funniest part about this eternal problem is that it was practically tested and solved already in 1996 and will be nonethelesss ongoing discussed in forums on a monthly basis. The information is based on a study by Martin Reed with Ilford and can easiliy be found by searching "Vortex" here on FADU.

I am following the advice posted by Terry in the first post for a long time now. Of course, I take 4 baths with a slightly increased time. You can never be sure. ;-)

http://www.film-and-darkroom-user.or...=print+washing

http://www.film-and-darkroom-user.or...=print+washing
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Old 16th May 2022, 10:07 AM
JOReynolds JOReynolds is offline
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I rinse excess fix off in a dish of water and wash them in a butler sink with a cold tap, which generates a satisfactory swirl. But I've noticed occasional scratches, eventually traced to where sharp corners of prints have scraped against the emulsion side of gloss prints.
I've just ordered a box of pearl paper and took note of the price per sheet! I shall not rely on the swirl, soaking and refilling as recommended.
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