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  #1  
Old 25th February 2021, 05:56 PM
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Default Stacking a polariser and a yellow filter.

I have read somewhere that it may be desirable to stack a polariser and yellow filter to give blue skies a more natural look with B&W panchromatic film. Does anyone do this, if so what are the results and does it make any difference which filter is placed closest to the front element of the lens? Polariser first then yellow or visa, versa?
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Old 25th February 2021, 06:35 PM
John King John King is offline
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Default Stacking filters

It will have some effect but may not be consistent. It all depends which way you are pointing the camera in relation to the sun. I am not a great lover of Polarising filters but I believe the most effective direction is with the camera at 90 degrees to the sun. wuth a yellow filter you will loose anything between 1.5 and 3 stops. Add a polariser and you can add at least another 3 stops lost. I would say mandatory tripod country.

A yellow on it's own is easier and for decades this has been the fall back filter to render blue sky a more natural (perceived) tone. Try yellow first before the polariser. Orange and red have a more pronounced effect and can be a bit OTT unless that is what you are after.

I knew a photographer who did use a 8x red coupled with a polarising filter and the results were akin to that given by Infra Red film. Again it was hit or miss depending on the sun's angle. They were actually quite good, but he was very careful what he photographed.

Last edited by John King; 25th February 2021 at 06:42 PM.
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Old 25th February 2021, 07:17 PM
Richard Gould Richard Gould is offline
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You7 can try it, but you would be better yousing the plain colour filter, yellow will give you a more naturel looking sky, and orange, will give a more pronounced effect, and red a very much deeper darky, moodier sky, Like John, I would start with the yellow, then for a more pronunced sky go with the orange and see how you like them, i don't like thge red, I find it much to deep and moody for my liking, I mostly stay with the orange, and if you want to try combining polar and yellow, remember that the factor of the pola can vary, depending upon the amount of the polarising you get to, so you could end up with a 3 or 4 stop increase,
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Old 25th February 2021, 07:25 PM
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I agree with the others that a yellow filter leads to the most naturalistic of skies.
I remember with transparencies, I often found that a polarizing filter led to an uneven darkening of the sky, one side of the picture being darker than the other.
Another point to be aware of is the possiblity of vignetting due to filter stacking.
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Old 25th February 2021, 08:28 PM
John King John King is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MartyNL View Post
I agree with the others that a yellow filter leads to the most naturalistic of skies.
I remember with transparencies, I often found that a polarizing filter led to an uneven darkening of the sky, one side of the picture being darker than the other.
Another point to be aware of is the possiblity of vignetting due to filter stacking.
The variation in sky colour is almost a certainty. Polarisers are best left for suppression of reflections off non metallic surfaces, water polished wood, plastics, shiny leaves etc.

I have to say I have never had a problem with vignetting. Two filters will not cause any cut off unless used with extreme wide angle lenses.
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Old 25th February 2021, 10:35 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is online now
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The real benefit from a polariser is that it does not alter colours as does a colour filter but that assumes that retaining the colours as if there is no filter is important

It does "cost " a bit more in exposure increase that's needed compared to a yellow but not by much

John has already touched on the suppression of reflection from surfaces such as water and glass which is the other benefit

In wide angle lenses of maybe 28mm or more likely 24mm on a 35mm camera there can be unintended changes on the blueness of the sky in the corners of that sky

Mike
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Old 26th February 2021, 11:17 AM
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As mentioned before, yellow, orange or red are the filters to darken the sky in B&W. In colour, the way to darken the sky is the polarizer.
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Old 26th February 2021, 12:46 PM
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I tried this with a digital camera set to mono (well, why not?) and found that using the two filters makes little difference except to add more contrast. Which filter is on top is immaterial (I suppose there could be reflection issues; but leave that aside).

If you're using a TLR or an SLR, you can see for yourself what tonal separation either filter gives you on its own: I presume that that is what "natural looking" refers to. I did the same trial with a film SLR and found that the sky's colour made the experiment too uncertain.

The only thing to do is to do the experiment on film, make notes and go from there.
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Old 26th February 2021, 04:30 PM
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I use a yellow + polariser together sometimes.

I have always stacked the filters yellow as nearest the camera then polariser - as I tend to have the yellow fitter in any case.

I find the effect different to just having say an orange in place of the yellow.

I find the difference is in the clouds mainly.

Of course yellow does not darken the grass in the same way as orange does.

I have also tried a polariser with deep yellow, light orange and yellow/green.

Watch out though - the filter factors are additive and you start needing to use a tripod.

It doesn't work in all situations but there are some where it is really quite a pleasant effect.

Looking through the viewfinder will show you want you are getting.

If I were you I'd try it in a few different scenarios and see if you like the effect.

Martin
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Old 26th February 2021, 04:46 PM
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If you're using a TLR or an SLR, you can see for yourself what tonal separation either filter gives you on its own: I presume that that is what "natural looking" refers to.[/QUOTE]

By "natural looking" what I was trying to say was, I prefer to see a sky that is represented by a tone of grey that is realistic and not too dark or too light, giving good separation between the clouds and the ground. Perhaps not the best choice of words, but skies do tend to be an important part of landscape photography and I am trying to get better at it.
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