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  #31  
Old 28th March 2010, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike O'Pray View Post

If I have understood the zone system, 6 stops still gives detail from zones 3 to zone 8. To cope with low light situations this seems quite a good trade off in terms of acceptable prints.

Mike
If you only have six stops to play with then using a 10 zone system, each zone becomes only 0.6 of a stop and not one full stop. So assuming you have calibrtaed evrything for a 6 stop scale, then metering what you think should be a zone 3 value and closing down 2 ZONES equates to closing down 2 x 0.6 stops = 1.2 stops. And that means one stop or 1 1/3 stops to place your exposure on zone 3.
This is only going to work for a subject of 6 stop scale from black to white.
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  #32  
Old 28th March 2010, 11:53 AM
Neil Smith Neil Smith is offline
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This raises another question which is of interest to me. If Delta 3200 is to be developed in Prescysol, what is the best EI to rate it at?

I would suggest 1000 as that is what Ilford suggest as its true ISO but I would be interested to hear if anyone else has used this combination and I will be interested to hear how Neil's film came out rated at 1600.


Steve.
I developed the Delta 3200 (35mm) last night in Prescysol EF 1:1:100. The results I post here are based purely on observation on a light box, by the unaided eye and with a 10x loupe.
The film was developed for 10.5 mins partial stand method at 24C, and was rated as I said earlier at 1600. The first thing I notice backs up what Percepts stated "My guess is that you will get very flat negatives with delta 3200 / Prescysol combination" which I think most people who have used Prescysol would have expected. But I wanted to test what results I would get from the standard recommended time/dilution before trying a different strength of Prescysol to increase contrast. The film had shots that were taken in a mix of lighting situations, and as you can expect the shots taken in low contrast lighting will need to be printed on a very high grade to compensate. There are a few shots that were taken in much higher contrast lighting, but these are still lower in contrast than one would prefer, but all shots would be printable with some work.
The rating of 1600 is too high for this film dev combination and my working methods. I would guess that 1250 or 1000 would work for me. I have another film in camera which has been rated at 1600, but I intend to rate the end of the film at 1000 and 1250 and try developing in a stronger dilution of Prescysol EF possibly 2:2:100 and see what results I get with this.
Finally the grain in the film seems to be well managed and not excessive, and despite the low contrast the images seem sharp and detail shows up well for such a fast film. Though this would be easier to comment on if I had a print, which at present is not an option due to work commitments. Obviously changing dilutions of the developer will have an effect on grain and acutance, when I have tried the next test I will let anybody interested know in this thread.


Neil
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  #33  
Old 28th March 2010, 07:24 PM
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Thanks Neil. I think I will try it around 800 - 1000 and see how that turns out although it does seem to be defeating the purpose of a film which was designed to be able to be pushed to 3200+ with the right developer.

Steve.
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  #34  
Old 28th March 2010, 08:00 PM
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Steve I know what you mean 1000 is a big compromise on 3200, but I am looking to find the fastest speed I can rate a film and still get the highest quality image. With this in mind I will also be testing other film/dev combinations till I get a result I am happy with.
It might turn out that I don't like the results and I will take another direction, I am going to try diafine and see what results I get with that. When I find a combination I like I will then stick with it and get familiar with it. It might be one combination for 1000 and another for 1600/3200 when I need the extra speed.

Neil
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  #35  
Old 28th March 2010, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Neil Smith View Post
Steve I know what you mean 1000 is a big compromise on 3200, but I am looking to find the fastest speed I can rate a film and still get the highest quality image. With this in mind I will also be testing other film/dev combinations till I get a result I am happy with.
It might turn out that I don't like the results and I will take another direction, I am going to try diafine and see what results I get with that. When I find a combination I like I will then stick with it and get familiar with it. It might be one combination for 1000 and another for 1600/3200 when I need the extra speed.

Neil
I have seen good reports of using xtol with D3200. Xtol being designed for t-grain films gives better speed than some others.
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  #36  
Old 28th March 2010, 09:50 PM
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I have seen good reports of using xtol with D3200. Xtol being designed for t-grain films gives better speed than some others.
thanks for the info I had come accross xtol in other posts I read elsewhere, as well as other developers recommended I will try several out score making my choice.

Neil
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  #37  
Old 28th March 2010, 09:53 PM
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That should say before not score
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  #38  
Old 28th March 2010, 10:04 PM
Mike O'Pray Mike O'Pray is offline
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Neil do try out several score - developers that is. You could then write a book about it and make some money. :

Seriously I have never come across a full scientific treatise on the range of film developers now available. A lot is written on various sites but sorting out the useful bits over many weeks/months is difficult compared to dipping into a comprehensive text.

Mike
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  #39  
Old 28th March 2010, 10:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Neil Smith View Post
That should say before not score
You have 20 or 30 minutes after posting to edit your post if you spot a typo soon after posting (I do it all the time!)...
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  #40  
Old 29th March 2010, 10:43 AM
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Decision time!

While using D3200 @1600 and altering development produces better negatives I am mindful that I am shooting on 120 format for quality reasons. There really is no point if the result is no better than an over cooked HP5 on 35mm. And... given that this thread seems to agree that there is no real way to resolve the grain problem of D3200 to a degree of desirability then I can only conclude the best way to tackle the issue is to use a different film. So its back HP5/HC-110 for me and invest in a sturdy monopod. D3200 will be reserved for when nothing else is a viable option.

I'm also mindful of the cost of DDX so I've just ordered some Prescysol EF to try with the D400. (Forum seems to approve of this combo.)

My original question to Les was about the effect of agitation, seems it should have been about D3200 aggravation. After all, if you guys are having to jump through hoops with repeated test after test to make D3200 usable then what chance a mere mortal such as myself.
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