![]() |
Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free: AG Photographic The Imaging Warehouse Process Supplies RH Designs Second-hand Darkroom Supplies |
![]() |
> With or Without Pre-soak? |
*** Click here for the FADU 2015/2014 Yearbooks *** |
![]() |
|
Article Tools | Search this Article | Display Modes |
![]() |
|||||||
|
|||||||
|
|||||||
|
#1
By
Dave miller
on
20th October 2008, 05:45 PM
|
![]() That’s interesting Bill, thanks’ for taking the trouble to carry out the experiment and publish your article. It bears out the results that several predicted in the tread where we discussed this subject. I think the most important fact to emerge is the need for consistent working practices rather than a need to soak or not.
|
#2
By
Peter Hogan
on
20th October 2008, 06:53 PM
|
![]() Glad you downrated the film, but what was your development time in relation to the recommended dev time? It's a fact that using rated ISO figures and recommended dev. times [B]will[B] result in overexposed and overdeveloped negs. Using standard developers you really need to downrate your film by as much as 30% to 50% and reduce dev times by a similar amount.
The proper route is to test to determine your own personal film speed and dev. times. (Shout if you don't know how) These will vary from person to person and even camera to camera of the same make! As to pre-soak I do, because I don't like the anti-halation dye in my dev, I don't want pinholes, and I believe pre-soaking gives more even development. However, it's a personal thing, and many people choose not to, and probably with no ill-effects. Peter |
#3
By
Bill
on
21st October 2008, 06:22 AM
|
![]() Hi Peter,
The Ilford site gives 11 minutes in ID11 at 1+1 with the film rated at 125 ISO and at 20 degrees C. I have plenty of books on testing film for personal speed and development, including Les McLean, Les Meehan, John Blakemore, Ansel Adams and Barry Thornton. I just need to get down to it and do the work. I don't pre-soak but seeing how it helps to maintain the developer temperature I probably will do from now on. Bill. |
#4
By
Dave miller
on
21st October 2008, 09:46 AM
|
|
![]() Quote:
![]() |
|
#5
By
Argentum
on
21st October 2008, 10:35 AM
|
|
![]() Quote:
I think this is not necessarily true. The question is how many stops of subject range do you expect to capture on film? Paper holds 7ish. Film manufacturers tend to give speed and dev times to capture 7ish stops on neg film. Now if you are a zone system person you will no doubt think you need 10 stops but that is not true for a lot of people and a lot subjects. If you assume 1 zone is one stop and then apply it to a manufacturers dev time for 7ish stops then you are making a mistake. If the film dev captures 7 stops then divide 7 by 11 ( 11 zones. 0 thru X) which gives 0.63 and then each zone is 0.63 stops. So if you then meter a zone 3 value you close down 1.26 stops and not 2. You would be 0.75 of a stop out if you used 2 stops. And if you meter a zone 8 value, then you open up 2 stops and not 3. You would be a stop out if you used 3. And that is where the myth comes from that film manufactuers speeds are wrong. It is zone system workers who think AA's 1zone = 1stop is a fixed rule. It isn't but they try to apply it to a neg range which it doesn't fit. Then they tailor development to fit the zone system and to do that they need more exposure and less development. But that doesn't mean manufacturers speed or dev times are wrong. Then the question is how many stops in the subject and how many can I get on the film without making the subject look flat because it's compressed too much. Most closed (no sky) subjects are 7 or less stops. Only when you start metering bright clouds and deep shadows do you start getting the 10 stop and plus ranges. |
|
#6
By
Bill
on
21st October 2008, 11:24 AM
|
|
![]() Quote:
![]() I think I will select just the one and stick with that. I need to read the appropriate sections again and make some notes for myself. In truth they are all fairly similar in method. Bill |
|
#7
By
Dave miller
on
22nd October 2008, 06:41 AM
|
|
![]() Quote:
|
|
![]() |
Support our Sponsors, they keep FADU free: AG Photographic The Imaging Warehouse Process Supplies RH Designs Second-hand Darkroom Supplies |
Article Tools | Search this Article |
Display Modes | |
|
|
![]() |
||||
Article | Article Starter | Category | Comments | Last Post |
Pre and Post Flashing | Les McLean | Articles | 25 | 14th October 2013 09:52 PM |
Split grade printing +pre flash? | Mike Meal | Ask Les | 2 | 15th March 2009 08:31 PM |
Pre - cut mats / window mounts | Rob Archer | Print Finishing | 5 | 29th November 2008 05:46 PM |
Pre-soak | Dave miller | Monochrome Film | 31 | 9th November 2008 09:52 AM |